The Republican Party has been engineering that stupidity for decades. And have taken it to the pinnacle recently by using tax money to fund private and usually religious schools. They are now closing public schools because of decreased attendance. We are poised to get even more stupid. This along with the changes brought about by the internet allowing people to “do their own ‘research ‘ “ has lowered it to the bottom of anything we could have thought possible .
yes. we all watched it happen: education in this country is not valued: it's despised: elites, they call it. When I was substitute teaching, I was told to teach the tests (Bush's no child left behind crap). What was not on any test? History. Civics. The Constitution. And here we are, with a populace so ignorant and ill-informed that we are now a dictator's wet dream.
I continually am astonished with how very little people know about civic and American government. The called democrats fascist .. excuse me that has always been extreme right ideology.
Gloria, you shouldn't be surprised OR astonished. People don't know about their government because it isn't taught in schools and hasn't been for years.
It is taught, at least in NY. My husband teaches Social Studies and the 3 branches of government. Is it in danger? Absoluteley. but not because it hasn't been taught.
And NY went blue. Elsewhere, look at the curriculum. I'm in SF Bay Area, definitely blue, but when Bush W was dragging this country down, a generation of children got left behind. Before that, in the 1970s, we passed Jarvis-Gann (,prop 13) , the changeling born of greed and fear mongering. It gutted California schools, junior colleges, and universities forcing tuition into outer space. And while corporatocracies profited and senior citizens benefited, the rest of us watched property taxes turn the housing market into scorched earth. Two generations of people fell through the corporate cracks and fear grew like an algae bloom. And there was no history taught in the middle-class and lower middle class areas. 15 years or so ago, I taught a high school history class as a long-term sub. When I got to the class mid-October, the students had had no teacher, no books, no curriculum, and a classroom with 38 students, and not enough desks. This was in a middle-class community. We are seeing the results of the widespread unfunding of public schools and the unmonitored privatization of education via charter schools. And if this happened here in the 5th largest economy in the world, then you can be damn sure the poorer states are even more educationally impoverished. And here we are.
NCLB was the “legal” beginning of the end of meaningful education in our public schools (I taught for 40 years in the inner city/barrio). Then the focus ($ to get funding)was strictly on Standardized Testing—just filling in the bubble, no critical thinking required. We don’t want educated citizens in this country, because they VOTE!
It’s truly disgusting & heartbreaking ….we have no idea who we are & how we got here!
I am obviously one of the exceptions to your "most are" comment. I'm 73, considered a Baby Boomer from being born in 1951. I have NEVER supported the Orange Insurrectionist, never will. I abhor what the Rethuglican Party (mostly) did to education in this nation, I detest the way toxic masculinity has caused so many to feel threatened by a strong multi-ethnic woman as possible President, and I am so disheartened by the way this country has moved to a convicted felon as President that I am seriously considering leaving the land of my birth. (I have voted Democrat all my life, AND I live in Georgia.)
I completely agree. I am 74 and I’m the one who posted on this site that I was browsing the Canadian immigration website on Wednesday when it crashed. I have never voted for a single republican. I’ve been crying a lot.
My granddaughter is a senior in high school in Maine. She's taking civics, social studies, English Lit and economics. So yes it gets taught. What we ought to have a "civics course" for people older than 18.
People have historically voted against there own interests. There is club for Republicans that do that called The Log Cabin Club. Presumably educated people, and still.................................
A favorite professor of mine calls our current epoch “the death of expertise.” Because everyone can Google anything, people think they know more than experts. And Trump plans to take it a step further by firing all civil service officials who don’t swear loyalty. He plans to let Elon Musk and Robert Kennedy Jr “go wild” with health and economics - two men who are also cognitively unable and financially conflicted. I now understand what the Dark Ages looked like. And we are rushing headlong into darkness.
Yep what people don't realize is you can only "Google' what they allow you to be exposed to that's controlled too just like in China. My results are more and more limited (every month it seems)!
Yes, I now see only sponsored results to questions I Google. I have to scroll considerably to find peer-reviewed medical articles. I know to do that but many people just accept the corporate-sponsored propaganda. And wait until RFK junior takes over our healthcare. One article said that’s the equivalent of putting Hannibal Lector in charge of our food supply.
I heard someone suggest that the way to make progress is in local politics, school boards, city councils. I do work for campaigns, I will pay closer attention to local politics.
Government-run education by the socialist-marxist education system is the reason at least two generations of children have been dumbed down into sniveling snowflakes that can't perform simple math equations without a calculator, don't understand American and world history, believe the lie that there are more than two genders, and don't understand that socialism is a dismal failure wherever it has been practiced. Citizens should not be required to pay taxes for govt schools unless they utilize them.
Well, I couldn't disagree with you more. It is not and never has been a socialist-Marxist education system. And just where do you learn and get information?
So you're saying you and your child were taught that the state should own all business and that democracy is bad? I don't believe that is what was taught in a US public school, ever.
I attended school in Kalifornia where the libs rubber-stamped the socialist and oft anti-constitutional beliefs of the Left. That state became so repulsive, I moved my new wife to Colorado where, within a few short years, the Left became a majority in the statehouse to aid their faggot governor into legalizing recreational drug use, demonizing firearm owners, and making an illegal end run around the state constitution that required a public vote on any tax increase - they simply increased taxes at will by calling them fees. A deadlocked 8-member state supreme court could not reverse the Denver (read: libtard) lower court ruling that it wasn't cheating to nullify the will of the people via WordSpeak. Became infuriated by commie teachers telling my daughter lies on a daily basis e.g., the Second Amendment exists only to allow the federal govt to raise a standing army. To hell with all liberals. Had to flee commieColorado for a southern red state where the Constitution is still the law of the Land and marxist b.s. is not tolerated.
First the dumbing down of the public school curriculum is the direct result of the attention and action of libertarian leaning and Republican politicians in general. They constantly called out the failings of Urban schools, knowing full well it is and was the lack of funding those schools faced that determined the negative outcomes. Racist to the core are and were these positions. Those positions relied on the fears of mostly white voters and motivated them to approve measurable standards and metrics that were never proven to be accurate!
These standards degraded the learning environment for all students on whom they were applied! This result was the direct consequence of Republican policies and leads to the desired outcome of a voucher system that will and is degrading public education as planned. This is a coup that was conceived to insure unequal educational outcomes while simultaneously sending public money to the schools of the well to do!
I grew up around Dutch reformed families and they have been complaining since the mid sixties in my experience of how they should get public money as they are relieving the taxpayer of the burden of educating their children. An interesting idea. First consider they not only choose to self educate their children they pretty insist on this for members of their church/ community. Secondly consider that they still want tuition paid for in addition to the public money given to them. This insures the education that they can deliver will be of a higher caliber simply due to greater funding. Funding that has little or no oversight on content, public or national interest and is fully open to the vagrancies of religious indoctrination and prejudice!
Remember Betsy DeVos US Secretary of Education she is Dutch Reformed and she pushed this agenda!
I feel it is frightening that Russian interference might have played a big role, and all the evidence of collusion will be deleted. Those who voted for Trump or any of the third party candidates, or did not vote, may not realize that they set themselves up to live in a Christian Nationalist theocracy.
Russia most definitely was involved. The bomb scares at several polling places were traced to them. The thing I found worse than foreigners interfering, though, was that the RNC tried to stop those polling places that had been shut down to sweep for bombs from getting court permission to stay open later to give the voters their chance to vote. And it didn't even matter. The Republican party has become the NO! party. Anything the Democratic Presidents have tried to pass through Congress for years now has been met with NO! from the Right. Any attempts to correct inequalities against minorities? NO! Women's Rights? NO! Climate Change? NO...HAHAHAHA...Not real!, so....NO!
But the VOTERS. In a way, I "get" the politicians - they crave power and love control. But the people who voted for "him" (I will not say that name. And I will NOT put a title of any kind in front of it if I'm forced to say it just to clarify who I'm speaking so horribly about!), I do not understand and will not forgive. People who pretend to be good, kind, generous and law-abiding, voted yesterday for a convicted sex offender who clearly looks down on all minorities and knows nothing about the holy book those fools can quote like the ABC's. He openly shows contempt for so many, yet they embrace him, as if even The Golden Rule has been deleted from American life ....just like so much of our actual history will be deleted from text books.
That's enough.....if I don't stop here I'll just keep going. Because I'm MAD. I'm so, so sad for America, the country that has been fought for again and again for decades....for what, now? Many of the changes made after those fights will be reversed. But for the people who consider themselves Americans? For the half that voted for him I feel rage....and disgust. Yeah....they make me sick.
I will, once things get organized and feel safe. My daughter's in-laws are the nicest people in the world, and they voted for that bastard because they worry what they've been lied to as the "bad economy" and how it's affecting THEM. They take lavish vacations, drive new cars, live in a gated community...and obviously have zero money worries. But the fear of maybe not being wealthy was the driving force behind ignoring character traits they KNOW don't indicate a "GOOD PERSON."
My husband and I, on the hand, drive older cars and never travel farther than we're reasonably sure those vehicles can take us! We do live in a nice, desirable neighborhood, but only because we bought our home before everyone else wanted to live here, too!
All of that was to say that here, in Alabama, where people are pros at being fake, it might not get to where it feels dangerous. People here have always been sweet as sugar to your face, but don't turn your back! Practically everyone carries a gun, but they always have. They've gotten real good at acting like they're not at all racist, and they don't really have anything against gender diversity, same sex marriage and all "the gay stuff......except for the fact that the Bible DOES condemn that sort of thing, so.....
Point is, hopefully, it shouldn't be hard for us to mingle with the family at Christmas since I'm very used to people who know I'm a Democrat ignore that for the sake of "manners" . I've been "one of the few" in so many places for so many years now
that I forget about it sometimes.
It's the fear of the unknown future, though. If what he has hinted at while campaigning is actually carried out, none of us (certainly not seniors) will be safe protesting or even speaking out. Just like his court cases, I think my anger will eventually go away, to be replaced with resentment and bitterness for the loss of "how it SHOULD have been", and I'll just be happy if we're able to afford to keep our house. It would sell for much more than we paid for it, and we would love to be able to leave that profit to our daughter.
(Thanks for reading all of that ...I know I got very much off-topic and just expressed my feelings. I imagine there will be a lot of that coming from me! I appreciate even one "listener", since writing down what's in my head does help ease the swirl of confusion and frustration.)
I'm so tempted to just delete it , but I've been sitting here spewing it out for just too long, damnit!! Best of luck to you going forward!💙✌🏼✊🏼
I’ve never been to Alabama, and I’m up hard liberal so you can imagine how I picture it. I’m very happy to know that there are good people like you who care about the world and the country and the future. I’m a senior too, and I worry for so many out there. The seniors, the minorities, anyone not straight, white and “Christian” but I do believe in a higher power that looks over us, and I hope that everything will be OK, even though I know it will not. But we can still care and love and fight and resist, and eventually Goodwill triumph over evil. I wish the best for you and for all of us. Well almost all of us.
It's dangerous to assume too much about the opposition. Stupidity certainly plays a part in collecting their base, but it is not the only reason (nor is racism, sexism or any one 'phobia'). The closest thing to a common thread is "I got mine". View the Latino vote for Trump. I'm not at all sure it contained many naturalized immigrants, but it was chock full of moderately successful second and third generation citizens. The vaunted "economic anxiety" was less working class and more small business owners, part time entrepreneurs, middle managers, used car salesmen, hucksters, shysters, ambulance chasers and assorted other suburban detritus worried less about losing what they have than losing the ability to lord it over their slightly less successful neighbors. Stupid? Maybe, depends on what sort of intelligence you measure and how.
For me, intelligence is shown by the choices one makes. It seemed pretty simple: convicted, criminal and rapist versus caring, intelligent woman. Hmm. Let me see.
I’m glad some of them had signs, red hats and Trump bibles…At least I know who they are…..it is the ones that didn’t….its not about policy differences this time.
I think for some people it was, but a misguided understanding of them. My neighbors just don't want their groceries and everything else to cost as much, and the current president gets the blame. I don't think everyone who voted for Trump is going to be happy with the results of their choice.
The people who voted for Trump because prices are too high are going to be sorely disappointed when tariffs make everything more expensive, and ICE starts rounding up the people who harvest their food.
Edit: And another thing...if you're choosing a candidate because that candidate says he's going to make your groceries cheaper BUT ALSO was responsible for taking away abortion rights and constantly scapegoats queer people and immigrants, your priorities are severely misplaced.
When was the last time Americans elected a president to help their neighbors?
One of the talking points for his fans was he didn’t do all the things he threatened when he was in office. They don’t believe it will happen now. Yes, I think they will be in a hard spot. Will they blame him?
Well, it looks like there is also a Republican Senate, so much easier to get what he wants, even though he claimed/lied, again, about not knowing what Project 2025 said. Vance does, for sure. Be afraid, be very afraid.
Edgar, another instance of people not understanding civic or American government. Those danged tariffs are paid in America by Americans .. plain and simple.
I wonder though if we as a party didn’t really understand or try to understand those voters. It’s fine to have all of these talking points on how great the economy is and how high the stock market is, but when you’re not in the stock market and you can’t make ends meet, that’s real. I wonder if the poor and rural voters expressed their anger by using the only tool available to them, by voting out the current administration. Dems didn’t pay enough attention to that dynamic. FWIW.
I think there’s truth to this. I think a lot of poor and working class people are steeped in the same right wing propaganda as more prosperous republican voters, though, so you could argue that it’s an uphill battle. But you’re right - I don’t see evidence that big attempts were made to connect with working class and poor people.
I believe that's true. For every voter who couldn't afford housing, food, healthcare, dental care, insurance....it was a slap in the face when they're told "the economy is great"!
That's how it felt to me, but I knew VP Harris/Gov Walz would support economic improvements that benefited not only the middle class, but those in poverty as well.
People fail to see that corporate greed is what's robbing our daily lives. Many things that are blamed on any president are actually not under the control of any president ... purely misplaced blame. Look how many companies have gone bankrupt .. Why? .. the stock market keeps demanding a better bottom line .. companies can try to increase profits .. when that doesn't work the company lays off employees and continues to lay them off in order to maintain the bottom line .. until the day they can't please the stock market and they are forced to go belly up.
I believe you put your finger on it. It’s mostly the old “It’s the economy stupid.” It was a big danger sign when
1. People remembered his administration favorably. Much more than when he was in office. (This is typical of most presidents but most presidents didn’t act like him.)
2. That was mostly because of how they remembered prices & money in their pocket.
3. When he insults people they always believe they are ‘the good ones’ and will be unscathed. That we’ve seen a lot in different ways over the years. He took it to new heights.
The ironic thing is that a lot of that money was provided by stimulus checks authored by Democratic members of Congress to counter the economic ravages of COVID!
Exactly. Same for jobs coming to their town under Biden. But red machine took credit.
By destroying the credibility of anyone (especially the media) the negative things are not believed. This was intentional. He admitted it to Leslie Stahl.
— President Trump told Lesley Stahl he bashes press ‘to demean you and discredit you so ... no one will believe’ negative stories about him—
Yes, Cohn. But he found he didn’t need another one because with power he had enough willing to do his bidding.
No, I never watched it. I know enough about him and the way he operates.
The fact that people confuse a “reality” TV show with reality says a lot. I consider it a bigger p/r effort in the same vein as the tabloids where he learned to manipulate news.
One reason we don’t understand how his followers fall for all this is we don’t consumer their “alternative news.” For instance the thing about Harris supporting trans surgeries for inmates was the law implemented under Trump. So she said she would uphold the law. Typical answer for a non-trump prosecutor.
I meant the movie, "The Apprentice", that just came out. I learned some new things -- and was chilled far deeper than I had been before. Yes, seeing millions of Americans confuse "reality TV" with reality is frightening. I watched them at the rallies, havin' a good ole time as their entertainer pranced on the stage, sexually abusing a flag, doing oral sex with a microphone. (HOW did these people bring themselves to vote for this piece of trash?! I just don't get it.
I think they meant the movie not the tv show. I saw “The Apprentice” a couple of days ago. It started out fairly positive but gradually portrayed his devolution. The theater was nearly empty. Trumpeters wouldn’t have believed it anyway. His rape of his first wife was not omitted.
I found this true in my red neighborhood too. High grocery prices and “Trump was better for the economy” were sited as reasons. And women didn’t believe the stories about women not being able to receive health care.
Every Trumpie seems to be able to point to some policy that was the reason they voted for Trump. The truth they don't say is that they voted the way they did because they were not about to allow a black woman to tell them what do so.
Corporate media has a lot to do with people's lack of understanding about the economy, constant reiteration of misconceptions around why the economy is rough for a lot of people coupled with zero analysis of how the economy works. Disgusted. Disgusting.
Also, we are used to engaging with people who read and pay attention to what is going on, but not everyone is like that. When I read a comment on NextDoor from someone who said she was going on "instinct" in leaning toward Trump, I just wanted to throw up my hands in despair. There were many comments on the thread about what kind of person Trump is, important to be sure! But hardly anyone mentioned policies.
I saw a focus group of undecideds. At the end a woman said she still had to do her own research in Kamila. The Facilitator asked what concerns she would have to research. Her answer: “That she slept her way to the top.” I was torn between shouting at the tv and bursting into tears.
We are very well positioned for the oligarchy that republicans have been dreaming of - currently there are only 2 or 3 of every major business types, thus the price gouging. Soon there will be ONE of every major business. With trump’s appointed oligarchs running each one.
I have a trump supporter neighbor. He is the nicest guy and will give you the shirt off his back. But he has little depth of knowledge and didn't even know who Jared Kushner was! He told me that a black woman couldn't run the country. I suspect a lot of trump supporters feel the same way.
I suspect fat too many of us defer to the Trumpies of the world to avoid unpleasantness at Thanksgiving. Going forward, here is my suggestion for all of us. For your "nice guy" neighbor, when the price of groceries and gas go up, look him in the eye and say " This is what you voted for." Trump supporters need to be held personally accountable for the chaos to come. If your "nice guy" neighbor is shocked at what actually happens in mass deportations of people, simply remind him and all like him you know who supported Trump "THIS IS WHAT YOU VOTED FOR."
YES! (Rick Wilson, a former top Republican strategist who became a leader in the Never-Trumpers and The Lincoln Project said recently, "You Democrats just don't get it. You have to be MEAN. Here. I'll show you how." And boy! did he ever!)
Would agree that its important to respond to people who are speaking trumpisms.
What I've noticed is that protrumpers want you to be upset; and when I'm not and respond with facts, it seems to stop them. Not that they believe anything I say. I don't engage their anger, I respond to what they say, firmly, at times.
Adding to Bob's comment. People who are depriving you of your freedoms, infringing on your happiness and peace of mind, are not your friends. They may be citizens of the US. That doesn't mean that we owe them respect or consideration, especially when they show none to us. Don't degrade your beliefs or your value system just to avoid a confrontation. In short, don't go along to get along. It never has and never will work against people who simply don't care what you think.
Yes! I am spending some time today crying and shouting and feeling all the feels. But, I will use all of this as motivation to speak up and when his supporters feel the consequences of their vote, I will most definitely point out that this is exactly what they wanted. Elections have consequences and according to Elon, everyone will experience economic hardships as they gut the government and rebuild it, so those voters will not escape it either.
Addendum: Rick is so sick at heart over the results of the election that he has not been able to write his substack. He had such high hopes that the Never Trumpers and The Lincoln Project would help us succeed.
Unfortunately so. They're more afraid of a smart black woman than they are the "Haitian cat eating queer illegal drug trafficking immigrants." Wherever they might be.
American society has not made social progress. Trump more than encouraged white supremist to publicly have their way. All those rebel flags just take us back to the days of slavery and hating every nationality of immigrant entering our country, as well as hating Native Americans and stealing their land.
Around the corner from me (where Harris-Walz signs line the street, is a guy with many large Trump flags, including one of Trump being held by Secret Service when he was shot, and one of "Farmers For Trump" (!). I haven't made his acquaintance....
At least HE admitted his bigotry! Most of them just continued the tired "it's the economy" schtick. Why can I easily find articles reporting that our economy is NOT in bad shape now? President Biden really DID improve things! Is the entire Internet set up to only show each of us what we want to see? (I know Facebook is, but Google, too? Because when I Google for info about the state of the economy, I get many headlines stating it's the envy of other major nations! WTF???) I actually had an argument with someone who told me that Jerome Powell probably lied....because he's a Democrat! The man whose JOB is to track and report on the State of the Economy of this nation was being called biased by my FRIEND (he's basically a relative so I can't end the relationship).
So they put all of the shameful, embarrassing, divisive remarks that POS made into their brain's garbage disposal and said the economy was better before Biden - at FIRST, it was, since Biden had to fix what his lunatic predecessor and COVID did. But Bidenomics WORKED....and he'll NEVER get documented credit for that...or for anything he accomplished, I guess. His own supporters laugh at him now, which breaks my heart.
Yes....maybe if Biden's VP looked like JD Vance we could have won over more Republicans for a minute. Then I'd have been happy to kick them back into their holes and gutters.
Ditto ditto. I am actually sick. I have a bad knee and I had an internal bleed this morning Fortunately my ortho doc was able to squeeze me into his schedule and drained it for me. Can stress actually cause that? Dunno.
I wish you were my neighbors. I am surrounded too, family, neighbors, congregants who are big DT supporters. I feel more at peace here among strangers with like minds. What’s up with that?
Me too, but let's not stop trying, because when we do, we become a mirror of their hate. I do not believe you can fight hatred with hatred, and I am endeavoring not to fall into that trap. It is a trap, but it is seductive. Our country is heading in this direction because people have begun to feel comfortable with hatred, which has been reigned on them from Rush Limbaugh, to Alex Jones to J.D. Vance. Do not get comfortable with it.
Your neighbors may be fine. I live in a small Texas rural town. MY neighbors are the problem.. They're very genteel. No yard signs at all. Yet they are MAGA to the core.
Vote counts are a more reliable measure. I live in an area outside Louisville that often splits the vote & voted down the anti-abortion amendment. But it hasn’t changed its voting for a GOP president since Bill Clinton. The few signs in the area were 3:1 Harris / Walz.
In the very red western rural part of the state last week we only saw 2 trump signs. But state voting results were 2% more for trump than 2020.
Me too. I watch for little opportunities to be kind to those who don't expect it. let someone ahead in line, hold the door for the next person. It primes the pump for the passing of grace which heals.
I respectfully disagree with Judd here. This isn't just America right now. This is America. It likely always was and the mythology we told ourselves about this country appears to be just that. A myth. There may be a subset of us in this nation who do hold and live up to lofty ideals, but other than the handful of times this nation pulled itself from the brink at the last possible moment, it repeatedly shows its core values.
We've gone back to the 1920s when this country was ruled by a few extremely wealthy white men. And the 1920s ended in the Great Depression. That's where we are going.
The retrograde ride is still picking up speed. This country is headed to a time earlier than 1920, but now it has automatic weapons, jets and nuclear weapons packed for the trip.
I suspect you may be more correct on this matter, than I'd like to admit; though the last several years I've been loosing heart for America/ Americans & think about moving overseas, where it's perhaps less personal for me. Too much willful ignorance. Too many folks imo, are unable " to see the forest through the trees, " nor understand the potential for unintended consequences built into some of these choices. Too many that don't appear to care about their fellow humans in any significant way.
Stay here and work for our Public Education System. We need more well-educated Americans. If a good education was not available for the tRump voters, it's not THEIR fault. It's that we were not paying close attention when our tax dollars went to religious schools.
The old Thomas Zimmer argument. I concur. In the coming 250th year of the Union, will we the nation learn to atone and move past the original sins of the Natives’ extermination, and chattel slavery? Will we learn to keep defending democracy while safely dismantling our empire abroad? Will we embrace our destiny as a vibrant, pluralistic democracy in all spheres of life, ‘achieving our country’, as Richard Rorty put it? A small part of me wonders
And after that, if you're a menstruating girl or women, they will use the monitor which is currently being used in China (I was astounded to learn that such a thing actually exists) to keep track of your periods.
Big government and BIG business closely linked! It’s called fascism . Chris must know this???? Big corporations already own you through your use of cell phones, computers, etc.
Edward Snowden told the American public years ago. But, no , destroy the person who tried to alarm us against our own government spying on us. We have been stupid for a very long time.
Edward living in exile in Russia!!!! Make a trade… all of MAGA for one Edward Snowden.
Yes, what happened today will endanger your nation, too. Once the orange sadist pulls us out of NATO, and turns Ukraine over to his pal Pukin, all of Europe becomes endangered starting first with the Eastern European nations.
Excellent point! Shall we write him? Speak up while we still can, because we all know that in the very near future, our voices won't be heard (if we even still have our voices.)
Yes, Aileen, these devastating results will reverberate around the world and affect everyone on many levels for years to come. This is simply gut-wrenching. I’m at a complete loss.
C'mon, you know his first act as president will be to pardon himself and erase all sign of any wrong doing! Then the purge will begin of all who have wronged him in any way. Hang on to your hats, the whirlwind of retribution and revenge is just beginning.
I stand corrected because in the first two weeks of his new presidency he has already attempted to fire all of the people associated with his prosecution.
Again, he is literally keeping promises to himself of retribution because his ego is more important than the people he “serves” as president! He needs to stop blaming others and start doing the correct things for the whole country.
I seriously doubt he gets anything other than a light probation. The state of NY is not going to put Trump in jail when he needs to be available for the transition. The federal cases will go bye-bye, the GA case might proceed without him. A sitting president can't be prosecuted.
Agree. I’m 62 and won’t be around when all the shit that’s going to happen truly bears fruit in the next two decades. But I worry about my 21-year-old daughter and what the U.S. will be like when she’s 40.
I feel let down. I didn't think that America was this racist, hateful or destructive to its own people. They have no idea what they have unleashed because eggs were expensive.
I quit eating eggs in 1986. The price of eggs does not affect me. However, the knowledge of what happens to ALL the male chicks in the hatcheries, and the horrible lives the hens live, affects me greatly. How ridiculous it has been for me to ever think for one minute that people would care about chickens when.. as we see today… people won’t even care about people. 💔
I raise my own hens, eat and sell the eggs, and live among many others who do the same... and who voted for Harris. Rural residents all, in a blessedly, mostly blue state. Have you seen any acknowledgement that we exist??? Or only the sterotype of rural, red America?
I know the hens come from hatcheries, where the males are either suffocated in big plastic bags, or tossed into a grinder. On their first and only day of life.
Kelly Jean, I feel the exact same way. I don't eat friggin' bacon and eggs. I care more about the animals, they are the pure souls on this earth. Now it'll be open season on them all and the destruction of the planet is now beginning. The extinction of humanity is a strong possibility. I'm thinking, maybe it's a good thing.
I now have had my lifelong intuitions come to fruition, the knowledge that the majority of people, in this country particularly, are ignorant, cruel bastards who worship money and nothing else. I don't like the feeling of needing to vomit every minute of the day, but I keep feeling like I'm going to puke, without stopping. 🤮😭
Thank you, Diane. The root of ALL of this, is lack of compassion, whether directed towards humans or animals.
Once you get to the point where you think it’s ok for animals to be raised in slavery and sent to slaughterhouses, is it really that far of a jump to think it’s ok to get rid of SOME people? I think the line is very thin.
I agree. Do they think covid inflation wouldn't have happened under Trump? Biden's agenda brought the country out faster than any other nation. Wait until the new tariffs are inactive. Inflation will go through the roof. He also wants to control the Fed. Great, just like his companies. We're in for a deep crisis.
I have a feeling that the tariffs won't be put on anything because he knows it's a losing proposition. It was something said to garner votes. Now that he has won, much of the stuff he promised won't happen, but it will be too late for all of us. I feel like I'm on a roller coaster that has not been inspected or maintained for years. You hope all will go okay, but are waiting for the first broken rail or collapsing support beam to fail, yet the operator just upped the speed and broke the brakes.
I don’t believe Dems have a messaging problem. Look at how mainstream media obsessed about Biden’s age but not trump’s. They didn’t go into all the good Biden did while ignoring and normalizing all the bad trump’s doing. Those billionaires sold out the working class. trump supporters will suffer like us but they’ll be happy to see Hispanic’s deported - regardless of their legal status
Somewhere in the back of my mind I saw this as if it had to happen, but rejected it in the belief that humanity would win out. Now it's like watching some terrible tragedy happen in slow motion.
I'm heartsick, for my daughter who will now choose not to have children due to the fear of what could happen in a high risk pregnancy. Even more so for her many friends who she worked with in childcare, DACA immigrants who fear they will either be separated from their children when they are deported or who must take their children to live somewhere foreign to them. In my own family, my 93 year old father, who supported Trump does not believe that kind of cruelty truly exists. My sister, who supported out of a self-righteous belief that she everything he says is true based only on her "pro-life" indignation doesn't realize what could happen to her Hispanic husband and children.
Can you kindly remind me of what the Dem's message actually was? It seems not to have made a strong enough impression to change the minds of about 5M people...
The Dems didn't read the room (populace). Rerunning the same candidate was a tactical error. Pivoting to Harris at the last minute was a tactical error. Not having a primary (which would have had to happen much earlier than July) was a tactical error. Running on abortion rights (which I strongly believe in) was an error (Trump's position was that it was now in the hands of the states, and many put it on the ballot - if I was Repub I could vote for abortion rights and vote against Harris in many states).
I'm not trying to be unkind, but the Dems really didn't position the party in a winning way...It sucks to going backward and I (like pretty much all here) am scared.
What was the Dem message? Based on Harris's speeches, I'd say she was quite consistent on ...
Building an "opportunity economy" that helps YOU achieve YOUR goals. Specifically, if you want a family, here's tax incentives and policies. If you want to buy a home, here's a program to lower costs for you and build more houses. If you want to start a business, here's a program. And for everyone, going after price gouging, cutting medical costs and protecting worker's rights.
Now, I get that doesn't fit on a stamp like "MAGA", which is vague promises about unicorns if we just get rid of migrants and raise taxes.
But I thought it was adults who vote, not gullible children. Guess I was wrong.
I agree! donald saying abortion is decided by the states and that’s supposedly enough to satisfy abortion rights advocates? Get real.
donald’s voters have been proven to be low information voters who believe his lies and soak up the disinformation on mainstream media and SM like Xitter.
I think Democrats’ problem is less the messaging and more owning the mighty propaganda machines ( and the will to use them with regard only for power, not truth)
I suspect disapproval of being shushed and threatened for protesting an ethnic cleansing and a genocide has more to do with this than eggs. Let's see how many registered Democrats sat out this election as compared to 2020, because that is going to reveal how impressed the rank and file are with their DNC operatives. When you up the ante of "lesser evil" to backing a genocide, that really does confuse a voter over what is "lesser." Independents turned out more than either party.
You're absolutely right that Biden voters stayed home - and that was the key difference.
But, I'm sorry to disagree on the "genocide" argument. It never occurred to me to abandong the only candidate demanding a ceasefire and two-state solution because I don't think their tactic was agressive enough.
America has now made her choice. Let's see how long it takes until we miss the Biden policy of diplomatic pressure.
Like you, I didn't make the choice to abandon what I saw as the only hope we had to avoid being ruled under a resurrected Confederate States of America, but I know those who could not bring themselves to support the genocide by lending their vote to give approval either. To call them "bothsiders" is a terribly shallow fabrication that trivializes the role the Democratic Party operatives took in bringing us both to being party to a genocide and installing Trump a second time. They followed their 2016 playbook to a T (no pun intended) and produced an even worse result.
Those who follow more than mainstream media, as we both do, will agree on your assessment that Trump will be worse. Indeed, BOTH parties fell all over themselves trying to curry favor with Netanyahu, but only one held Presidential power so only one (1!) was seen and experienced by American citizens as being too weak to stand up to him. Cripes! Biden and Blinken were willing to let him run our universities, govern our citizens with "loyalty oaths" to the Israeli government in 38 states, and advocate for lethal force being used on OUR children, not Israeli kids, who protested a genocide on our college campuses. That should NOT sit well with any American who is made furious by being called "antisemitic" for saying we will not be governed by Netanyahu. A party who pulls that s--t, and the Democratic Party DID DO THAT is going to lose votes. 13 million fewer Democrats voted for their party in 2024 than in 2020.
A confirmation is AOC's New York district that went overwhelmingly for Trump as their President AND for AOC as their Representative, knowing FULL WELL that the operatives of the Democratic Party--the same Democratic Party corporate mob wanting Lina Khan fired -- also want AOC and the "Squad" GONE as badly as the Republican corporate mob wants them gone. The people, when seeing some semblance of an option, aren't supporting the corporate mob. A vote for Trump and for AOC is clearly a vote of people fed up with this Democratic Party as run by its operatives.
Blaming media is too easy and won’t help us win next time. We need to look in the mirror, and figure out WHY people chose to vote the way the did. And if the glaring deficiencies of Trump couldn’t sway them, what would have?
Good question but looking at that clown at his last few rallies should have been enough for any person with 2-3 operational brain cells to see he is not qualified!!!
His followers never looked at any live stream of Trump's incoherent rallies. The regular media did not play up the rallies to show Trumps meandering, incoherent, violent rhetoric. Most all were available on YouTube. Sadly, the average person does absolutely no research for facts or the truth.
Right! They lined up with the racists because I guess in their marginalized minds, even a rapist, racist crook suffering from dementia is better than a woman! So now the simpletons got their way. I'm not going to ask "what's next."
Not that this helps us but the blame is squarely on the R party. They were too cowardly to not assign guilt in the impeachments. They supported all trump's bad behavior. They nominated him and helped him get elected. They are bad humans only seeking money and power
Americans were pissed enough at both parties to blow it all up so they did so. We are now all going to experience what life would be like had the Confederate States of America triumphed.
It seems the sentiments of the aristocratic Old South - Divine Right- ie education for the white and rich, control by the white and rich, because god is white and rich. Those sentiments just “won” the Civil War. Even more thoroughly than any contemporary Confederate could have hoped. Not overnight, but to the bone.
Nancy F, I agree. I hope every last one of them lives in pure misery every single day. I've never hated anyone before. I hate now, I have nothing but contempt for them all. They can ALL go straight to hell where they belong.
You don't DESTROY a country just because "waaaa😭, I'm not seen or heard enough, waaaa 😭" .......oh, my groceries are too expensive! I'll vote for a treasonous, ignorant bastard who's also a convicted FELON, that will definitely make life better. 🤬
I'm angry, very angry. I'm disgusted with the level of stupidity in this country. I'm also very very profoundly sad. Fuck them all. Every single one of those Maga maggots.
If it's ok to belittle and ridicule people, then fine, I'm speaking my mind about those red mofo's. I repeat, FUCK THEM ALL. 😢
The comments I heard from Black and Latino men absolutely BLEW MY MIND! "Women are too emotional." WTF??? Who is writing those ALL CAPS Untruth Sociopathic posts all night long with dozens of exclamations points?! (sort of like I'm doing now. Oh. I just realized I'm a woman. That probably explains it. No. Wait. the orange sadist is NOT a woman -- so far as we know -- so men can be emotional, too. Right? Hello, guys? Right?)
Ah! Bingo! I've been aware of Cheetolini (love it!)'s projection since Day 1. (Most primitive defense mechanism, according to Freud). Somehow I never extended that to include his FaithFul Follwers. Thanks for the insight.
Today's America if full of aggrieved white males. And yes .. it started when a fair election elected Obama. It unleashed the white supremacists and then Trump gave them permission to do anything they wanted.
Sadly too true. Look at the "landmark" of 2 Black women in the Senate at the same time... among how many women thete is total? Certainly not the 50 percent of the population that is female.
Really down, cannot believe more than half of the American people, and over 60%of the people in Florida where I live bought the bull$hit he was selling. Once a conman, always a conman.😭😭
Fellow Floridian. They didn't buy his BS, they know he was lying and they don't care. His persona (a cult if you will) is based on scapegoating those that are different. Every "issue" can be traced back to a different group to blame
Another fellow Floridian here. I was so hopeful that Florida might go blue this time. I never imagined Trump would win like this or at all. My whole family voted for Kamala.
A: Betrayed by my fellow citizens. Apparently, they can only learn the truth through severe pain. Wish they didn’t have to drag the rest of us through it. Very hard not to be furious at them. Idiots.
If it was only that! What about RFK removing fluoride from drinking water, no more mandatory or federally funded vaccines? And that is just the well known things. Then there is the elimination of the Department of Education! A long time dream of many. And Elon Musk in charge of cleaning up the budget. Say goodbye to SSA helping disabled people. And who knows what he will do to the elderly. The Dept of Justice will be under the direction of the President. No more separation of church and state. It just goes on and on. .
Susan Guyaux, don't forget, they plan to repeal HEALTH-CARE for the entire nation. So all those bacon and eggs eaters can die from their diseases because they won't have any health insurance. But boy, they could then afford to get more bacon with the orange Mussolini running the show! Disgusting. 😞
Gaza had some influence, but not too much. We all know it won't be any different under Trump. Harris won both the Jewish and Muslim majority. However Christians turned out big time for Trump.
I found out yesterday cheap gas is more important than our children’s future, that misogyny goes beyond race, that one’s personal comfort means hating the less fortunate, that being considerate to those different than you is an affront to freedom, that most people will do anything to make themselves feel bigger and stronger by tearing down the less fortunate and the marginalized. America has chosen a rapist, a con man, a racist, and a misogynist - we can no longer deny who we are as a people.
That's ridiculous. Every Red state has Democrats who voted for Kamala. You expect they can just move to California? Calling all *those people* maggots is not compassionate or productive.
Nancy Orr, it's my opinion. Trump's minions (and trump himself )weren't compassionate nor productive so don't preach to anyone about that. Apparently you've not seen the recent Wired news report about what, exactly, the CULT of MAGA are saying in their posts about ALL Democrats and Kamala etc.etc. go read it and then lecture about compassion and productivity.
Yeah, I know every red state has those who voted for Kamala . If immigrant people can be selectively deported from any state, then so can those red voters. The very people who wouldn't think twice about tossing YOU off a building.
There are "friends" I won't look at the same, knowing they voted for hate, division, racism, misogyny, homophobia... What's worse, is we'll be stuck with JD soon.
Or maybe, you could ask them why they voted the way they did, and I can almost guarantee you it wasn't for any of those reasons. Being stuck with JD is not worse than those things, what those things actually are. The fact that you say so suggests that they're incorporeal bogeymen, not the subjects of real experience, otherwise you wouldn't such a comparison. You act like hate, division, racism, misogyny, and homophobia are self-evident attributes of Trump. Which is harder to believe, that 71 million people (a significant portion of which are minorities) voted out of hateful, divisive, racist, misogynistic, homophobic bigotry, or that perhaps they don't see things the way you do? If you talk to them, you might also find out how much they all hate of those things too, and not the trivial things that get slapped with those labels all the time and drain the words of any meaningful significance.
We in America live amongst the most dangerously stupid people on earth
The Republican Party has been engineering that stupidity for decades. And have taken it to the pinnacle recently by using tax money to fund private and usually religious schools. They are now closing public schools because of decreased attendance. We are poised to get even more stupid. This along with the changes brought about by the internet allowing people to “do their own ‘research ‘ “ has lowered it to the bottom of anything we could have thought possible .
yes. we all watched it happen: education in this country is not valued: it's despised: elites, they call it. When I was substitute teaching, I was told to teach the tests (Bush's no child left behind crap). What was not on any test? History. Civics. The Constitution. And here we are, with a populace so ignorant and ill-informed that we are now a dictator's wet dream.
I continually am astonished with how very little people know about civic and American government. The called democrats fascist .. excuse me that has always been extreme right ideology.
Gloria, you shouldn't be surprised OR astonished. People don't know about their government because it isn't taught in schools and hasn't been for years.
It is taught, at least in NY. My husband teaches Social Studies and the 3 branches of government. Is it in danger? Absoluteley. but not because it hasn't been taught.
And NY went blue. Elsewhere, look at the curriculum. I'm in SF Bay Area, definitely blue, but when Bush W was dragging this country down, a generation of children got left behind. Before that, in the 1970s, we passed Jarvis-Gann (,prop 13) , the changeling born of greed and fear mongering. It gutted California schools, junior colleges, and universities forcing tuition into outer space. And while corporatocracies profited and senior citizens benefited, the rest of us watched property taxes turn the housing market into scorched earth. Two generations of people fell through the corporate cracks and fear grew like an algae bloom. And there was no history taught in the middle-class and lower middle class areas. 15 years or so ago, I taught a high school history class as a long-term sub. When I got to the class mid-October, the students had had no teacher, no books, no curriculum, and a classroom with 38 students, and not enough desks. This was in a middle-class community. We are seeing the results of the widespread unfunding of public schools and the unmonitored privatization of education via charter schools. And if this happened here in the 5th largest economy in the world, then you can be damn sure the poorer states are even more educationally impoverished. And here we are.
NCLB was the “legal” beginning of the end of meaningful education in our public schools (I taught for 40 years in the inner city/barrio). Then the focus ($ to get funding)was strictly on Standardized Testing—just filling in the bubble, no critical thinking required. We don’t want educated citizens in this country, because they VOTE!
It’s truly disgusting & heartbreaking ….we have no idea who we are & how we got here!
Not just in the US, there is a right-wing wind that's blowin".
Well I’m 77. My cohort had to go to government classes when we were in school. Most Trumpers are boomers.
I am obviously one of the exceptions to your "most are" comment. I'm 73, considered a Baby Boomer from being born in 1951. I have NEVER supported the Orange Insurrectionist, never will. I abhor what the Rethuglican Party (mostly) did to education in this nation, I detest the way toxic masculinity has caused so many to feel threatened by a strong multi-ethnic woman as possible President, and I am so disheartened by the way this country has moved to a convicted felon as President that I am seriously considering leaving the land of my birth. (I have voted Democrat all my life, AND I live in Georgia.)
Reside in NE Georgia as well. Independent, but largely have voted Democrat. I think about leaving every day.
I completely agree. I am 74 and I’m the one who posted on this site that I was browsing the Canadian immigration website on Wednesday when it crashed. I have never voted for a single republican. I’ve been crying a lot.
I don't agree. Young people were among the movers of the election. I am 78 and as strong a Democrat as there could be.
That's not true and too simplistic. https://www.dw.com/en/us-election-trump-lured-key-democrat-demographics-to-secure-presidency/a-70713548
My granddaughter is a senior in high school in Maine. She's taking civics, social studies, English Lit and economics. So yes it gets taught. What we ought to have a "civics course" for people older than 18.
Maybe gets taught in Maine but not everywhere.
What slays me is union members voting against Sherrod Brown. He was involved in getting thousands of pensions restored for union workers.
Great job. Voting against your interests. Think a Republican senate will EVER help union members?
Get ready for more a return to the anti union days of 1980-88.
People have historically voted against there own interests. There is club for Republicans that do that called The Log Cabin Club. Presumably educated people, and still.................................
So true!!
THIS! I’ve saying this for years! When NCLB was adopted, and civics and history weren’t tested, teaching them got pushed aside.
Well said..& sadly too true!
😢
A favorite professor of mine calls our current epoch “the death of expertise.” Because everyone can Google anything, people think they know more than experts. And Trump plans to take it a step further by firing all civil service officials who don’t swear loyalty. He plans to let Elon Musk and Robert Kennedy Jr “go wild” with health and economics - two men who are also cognitively unable and financially conflicted. I now understand what the Dark Ages looked like. And we are rushing headlong into darkness.
Yep what people don't realize is you can only "Google' what they allow you to be exposed to that's controlled too just like in China. My results are more and more limited (every month it seems)!
Yes, I now see only sponsored results to questions I Google. I have to scroll considerably to find peer-reviewed medical articles. I know to do that but many people just accept the corporate-sponsored propaganda. And wait until RFK junior takes over our healthcare. One article said that’s the equivalent of putting Hannibal Lector in charge of our food supply.
It feels very dark.
It feels pitch black. And not in a good way - like if a brilliant black woman was about to become president.
I agree - with praise for Musk firing people who try to unionize, are we headed back to feudalism? Feels like it.
I was afraid I could become a serf
My fellow democrats, time to start buying guns while it is legal. I know, it sounds fucking crazy. Oh, vote local too
I heard someone suggest that the way to make progress is in local politics, school boards, city councils. I do work for campaigns, I will pay closer attention to local politics.
Government-run education by the socialist-marxist education system is the reason at least two generations of children have been dumbed down into sniveling snowflakes that can't perform simple math equations without a calculator, don't understand American and world history, believe the lie that there are more than two genders, and don't understand that socialism is a dismal failure wherever it has been practiced. Citizens should not be required to pay taxes for govt schools unless they utilize them.
Well, I couldn't disagree with you more. It is not and never has been a socialist-Marxist education system. And just where do you learn and get information?
I went through the system and experienced the liberal-progressive-socialist b.s., then my daughter was taught the same commie b.s.
So you're saying you and your child were taught that the state should own all business and that democracy is bad? I don't believe that is what was taught in a US public school, ever.
I attended school in Kalifornia where the libs rubber-stamped the socialist and oft anti-constitutional beliefs of the Left. That state became so repulsive, I moved my new wife to Colorado where, within a few short years, the Left became a majority in the statehouse to aid their faggot governor into legalizing recreational drug use, demonizing firearm owners, and making an illegal end run around the state constitution that required a public vote on any tax increase - they simply increased taxes at will by calling them fees. A deadlocked 8-member state supreme court could not reverse the Denver (read: libtard) lower court ruling that it wasn't cheating to nullify the will of the people via WordSpeak. Became infuriated by commie teachers telling my daughter lies on a daily basis e.g., the Second Amendment exists only to allow the federal govt to raise a standing army. To hell with all liberals. Had to flee commieColorado for a southern red state where the Constitution is still the law of the Land and marxist b.s. is not tolerated.
Your language tells me not to listen to you.
First the dumbing down of the public school curriculum is the direct result of the attention and action of libertarian leaning and Republican politicians in general. They constantly called out the failings of Urban schools, knowing full well it is and was the lack of funding those schools faced that determined the negative outcomes. Racist to the core are and were these positions. Those positions relied on the fears of mostly white voters and motivated them to approve measurable standards and metrics that were never proven to be accurate!
These standards degraded the learning environment for all students on whom they were applied! This result was the direct consequence of Republican policies and leads to the desired outcome of a voucher system that will and is degrading public education as planned. This is a coup that was conceived to insure unequal educational outcomes while simultaneously sending public money to the schools of the well to do!
I grew up around Dutch reformed families and they have been complaining since the mid sixties in my experience of how they should get public money as they are relieving the taxpayer of the burden of educating their children. An interesting idea. First consider they not only choose to self educate their children they pretty insist on this for members of their church/ community. Secondly consider that they still want tuition paid for in addition to the public money given to them. This insures the education that they can deliver will be of a higher caliber simply due to greater funding. Funding that has little or no oversight on content, public or national interest and is fully open to the vagrancies of religious indoctrination and prejudice!
Remember Betsy DeVos US Secretary of Education she is Dutch Reformed and she pushed this agenda!
I feel it is frightening that Russian interference might have played a big role, and all the evidence of collusion will be deleted. Those who voted for Trump or any of the third party candidates, or did not vote, may not realize that they set themselves up to live in a Christian Nationalist theocracy.
Russia most definitely was involved. The bomb scares at several polling places were traced to them. The thing I found worse than foreigners interfering, though, was that the RNC tried to stop those polling places that had been shut down to sweep for bombs from getting court permission to stay open later to give the voters their chance to vote. And it didn't even matter. The Republican party has become the NO! party. Anything the Democratic Presidents have tried to pass through Congress for years now has been met with NO! from the Right. Any attempts to correct inequalities against minorities? NO! Women's Rights? NO! Climate Change? NO...HAHAHAHA...Not real!, so....NO!
But the VOTERS. In a way, I "get" the politicians - they crave power and love control. But the people who voted for "him" (I will not say that name. And I will NOT put a title of any kind in front of it if I'm forced to say it just to clarify who I'm speaking so horribly about!), I do not understand and will not forgive. People who pretend to be good, kind, generous and law-abiding, voted yesterday for a convicted sex offender who clearly looks down on all minorities and knows nothing about the holy book those fools can quote like the ABC's. He openly shows contempt for so many, yet they embrace him, as if even The Golden Rule has been deleted from American life ....just like so much of our actual history will be deleted from text books.
That's enough.....if I don't stop here I'll just keep going. Because I'm MAD. I'm so, so sad for America, the country that has been fought for again and again for decades....for what, now? Many of the changes made after those fights will be reversed. But for the people who consider themselves Americans? For the half that voted for him I feel rage....and disgust. Yeah....they make me sick.
thanks for your example of expressing your anger. We have anger for a reason. Let's channel it into courage and action.
I will, once things get organized and feel safe. My daughter's in-laws are the nicest people in the world, and they voted for that bastard because they worry what they've been lied to as the "bad economy" and how it's affecting THEM. They take lavish vacations, drive new cars, live in a gated community...and obviously have zero money worries. But the fear of maybe not being wealthy was the driving force behind ignoring character traits they KNOW don't indicate a "GOOD PERSON."
My husband and I, on the hand, drive older cars and never travel farther than we're reasonably sure those vehicles can take us! We do live in a nice, desirable neighborhood, but only because we bought our home before everyone else wanted to live here, too!
All of that was to say that here, in Alabama, where people are pros at being fake, it might not get to where it feels dangerous. People here have always been sweet as sugar to your face, but don't turn your back! Practically everyone carries a gun, but they always have. They've gotten real good at acting like they're not at all racist, and they don't really have anything against gender diversity, same sex marriage and all "the gay stuff......except for the fact that the Bible DOES condemn that sort of thing, so.....
Point is, hopefully, it shouldn't be hard for us to mingle with the family at Christmas since I'm very used to people who know I'm a Democrat ignore that for the sake of "manners" . I've been "one of the few" in so many places for so many years now
that I forget about it sometimes.
It's the fear of the unknown future, though. If what he has hinted at while campaigning is actually carried out, none of us (certainly not seniors) will be safe protesting or even speaking out. Just like his court cases, I think my anger will eventually go away, to be replaced with resentment and bitterness for the loss of "how it SHOULD have been", and I'll just be happy if we're able to afford to keep our house. It would sell for much more than we paid for it, and we would love to be able to leave that profit to our daughter.
(Thanks for reading all of that ...I know I got very much off-topic and just expressed my feelings. I imagine there will be a lot of that coming from me! I appreciate even one "listener", since writing down what's in my head does help ease the swirl of confusion and frustration.)
I'm so tempted to just delete it , but I've been sitting here spewing it out for just too long, damnit!! Best of luck to you going forward!💙✌🏼✊🏼
I’ve never been to Alabama, and I’m up hard liberal so you can imagine how I picture it. I’m very happy to know that there are good people like you who care about the world and the country and the future. I’m a senior too, and I worry for so many out there. The seniors, the minorities, anyone not straight, white and “Christian” but I do believe in a higher power that looks over us, and I hope that everything will be OK, even though I know it will not. But we can still care and love and fight and resist, and eventually Goodwill triumph over evil. I wish the best for you and for all of us. Well almost all of us.
My anger has helped me clean house.
Yes ma'am.
Not "might". DID.
Stupid almost gives them credit … it’s far worse than stupid I’m afraid.
Summed up nicely
The one sin every nation suffers and dies from is Idoltry. History proves this to be true. We never learn, do we?
It's dangerous to assume too much about the opposition. Stupidity certainly plays a part in collecting their base, but it is not the only reason (nor is racism, sexism or any one 'phobia'). The closest thing to a common thread is "I got mine". View the Latino vote for Trump. I'm not at all sure it contained many naturalized immigrants, but it was chock full of moderately successful second and third generation citizens. The vaunted "economic anxiety" was less working class and more small business owners, part time entrepreneurs, middle managers, used car salesmen, hucksters, shysters, ambulance chasers and assorted other suburban detritus worried less about losing what they have than losing the ability to lord it over their slightly less successful neighbors. Stupid? Maybe, depends on what sort of intelligence you measure and how.
For me, intelligence is shown by the choices one makes. It seemed pretty simple: convicted, criminal and rapist versus caring, intelligent woman. Hmm. Let me see.
You may be right:
https://dynamischarchief.nl/blobs/artviewing_scenografen/99387/2024/45/No_1.mp4
I feel let down by my own country.
I’m struggling to find the the ability to love my neighbors
I’m glad some of them had signs, red hats and Trump bibles…At least I know who they are…..it is the ones that didn’t….its not about policy differences this time.
It never was about policy differences.
I think for some people it was, but a misguided understanding of them. My neighbors just don't want their groceries and everything else to cost as much, and the current president gets the blame. I don't think everyone who voted for Trump is going to be happy with the results of their choice.
The people who voted for Trump because prices are too high are going to be sorely disappointed when tariffs make everything more expensive, and ICE starts rounding up the people who harvest their food.
Edit: And another thing...if you're choosing a candidate because that candidate says he's going to make your groceries cheaper BUT ALSO was responsible for taking away abortion rights and constantly scapegoats queer people and immigrants, your priorities are severely misplaced.
To that I’ll add 2 thoughts.
When was the last time Americans elected a president to help their neighbors?
One of the talking points for his fans was he didn’t do all the things he threatened when he was in office. They don’t believe it will happen now. Yes, I think they will be in a hard spot. Will they blame him?
Well, it looks like there is also a Republican Senate, so much easier to get what he wants, even though he claimed/lied, again, about not knowing what Project 2025 said. Vance does, for sure. Be afraid, be very afraid.
Never.
Edgar, another instance of people not understanding civic or American government. Those danged tariffs are paid in America by Americans .. plain and simple.
So true. Dad always told me it isn’t what a person says. “Watch what they do!”
I wonder though if we as a party didn’t really understand or try to understand those voters. It’s fine to have all of these talking points on how great the economy is and how high the stock market is, but when you’re not in the stock market and you can’t make ends meet, that’s real. I wonder if the poor and rural voters expressed their anger by using the only tool available to them, by voting out the current administration. Dems didn’t pay enough attention to that dynamic. FWIW.
I think there’s truth to this. I think a lot of poor and working class people are steeped in the same right wing propaganda as more prosperous republican voters, though, so you could argue that it’s an uphill battle. But you’re right - I don’t see evidence that big attempts were made to connect with working class and poor people.
I believe that's true. For every voter who couldn't afford housing, food, healthcare, dental care, insurance....it was a slap in the face when they're told "the economy is great"!
That's how it felt to me, but I knew VP Harris/Gov Walz would support economic improvements that benefited not only the middle class, but those in poverty as well.
People fail to see that corporate greed is what's robbing our daily lives. Many things that are blamed on any president are actually not under the control of any president ... purely misplaced blame. Look how many companies have gone bankrupt .. Why? .. the stock market keeps demanding a better bottom line .. companies can try to increase profits .. when that doesn't work the company lays off employees and continues to lay them off in order to maintain the bottom line .. until the day they can't please the stock market and they are forced to go belly up.
This.
I believe you put your finger on it. It’s mostly the old “It’s the economy stupid.” It was a big danger sign when
1. People remembered his administration favorably. Much more than when he was in office. (This is typical of most presidents but most presidents didn’t act like him.)
2. That was mostly because of how they remembered prices & money in their pocket.
3. When he insults people they always believe they are ‘the good ones’ and will be unscathed. That we’ve seen a lot in different ways over the years. He took it to new heights.
The ironic thing is that a lot of that money was provided by stimulus checks authored by Democratic members of Congress to counter the economic ravages of COVID!
Exactly. Same for jobs coming to their town under Biden. But red machine took credit.
By destroying the credibility of anyone (especially the media) the negative things are not believed. This was intentional. He admitted it to Leslie Stahl.
— President Trump told Lesley Stahl he bashes press ‘to demean you and discredit you so ... no one will believe’ negative stories about him—
2018 https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/22/trump-told-lesley-stahl-he-bashes-press-to-discredit-negative-stories.html
He learned well from his Master, Roy Cohn: 1. Attack
2. Deny everything 3. Win -- at all costs. (Have you seen "The Apprentice"? It's worth watching.)
Yes, Cohn. But he found he didn’t need another one because with power he had enough willing to do his bidding.
No, I never watched it. I know enough about him and the way he operates.
The fact that people confuse a “reality” TV show with reality says a lot. I consider it a bigger p/r effort in the same vein as the tabloids where he learned to manipulate news.
One reason we don’t understand how his followers fall for all this is we don’t consumer their “alternative news.” For instance the thing about Harris supporting trans surgeries for inmates was the law implemented under Trump. So she said she would uphold the law. Typical answer for a non-trump prosecutor.
I meant the movie, "The Apprentice", that just came out. I learned some new things -- and was chilled far deeper than I had been before. Yes, seeing millions of Americans confuse "reality TV" with reality is frightening. I watched them at the rallies, havin' a good ole time as their entertainer pranced on the stage, sexually abusing a flag, doing oral sex with a microphone. (HOW did these people bring themselves to vote for this piece of trash?! I just don't get it.
I think they meant the movie not the tv show. I saw “The Apprentice” a couple of days ago. It started out fairly positive but gradually portrayed his devolution. The theater was nearly empty. Trumpeters wouldn’t have believed it anyway. His rape of his first wife was not omitted.
They better be prepared to pay even more when, not if, the Albertson & Kroger merger goes through.
Yes, they are in for a BIG surprise!
I found this true in my red neighborhood too. High grocery prices and “Trump was better for the economy” were sited as reasons. And women didn’t believe the stories about women not being able to receive health care.
Every Trumpie seems to be able to point to some policy that was the reason they voted for Trump. The truth they don't say is that they voted the way they did because they were not about to allow a black woman to tell them what do so.
Bingo!
Or ANY woman really.
The fact is in racist sexist America it was about putting that black bitch in her place. Sad but true.
EXACTLY.
Corporate media has a lot to do with people's lack of understanding about the economy, constant reiteration of misconceptions around why the economy is rough for a lot of people coupled with zero analysis of how the economy works. Disgusted. Disgusting.
Also, we are used to engaging with people who read and pay attention to what is going on, but not everyone is like that. When I read a comment on NextDoor from someone who said she was going on "instinct" in leaning toward Trump, I just wanted to throw up my hands in despair. There were many comments on the thread about what kind of person Trump is, important to be sure! But hardly anyone mentioned policies.
I saw a focus group of undecideds. At the end a woman said she still had to do her own research in Kamila. The Facilitator asked what concerns she would have to research. Her answer: “That she slept her way to the top.” I was torn between shouting at the tv and bursting into tears.
We are very well positioned for the oligarchy that republicans have been dreaming of - currently there are only 2 or 3 of every major business types, thus the price gouging. Soon there will be ONE of every major business. With trump’s appointed oligarchs running each one.
So true. Noam Chomsky has been ringing the alarm bells for years.
Very true. Main stream media never held Trumps feet to the fire but jumped on any tiny slip from the Democrats.
I like the red hats. Makes 'em easier to spot. That, the mouth breathing, and drooling.
Don't forget the lack of grammar, spelling or cogent discourse.
Yes....hee,hee!
I have a trump supporter neighbor. He is the nicest guy and will give you the shirt off his back. But he has little depth of knowledge and didn't even know who Jared Kushner was! He told me that a black woman couldn't run the country. I suspect a lot of trump supporters feel the same way.
PS: I had no luck changing his opinion!
I suspect fat too many of us defer to the Trumpies of the world to avoid unpleasantness at Thanksgiving. Going forward, here is my suggestion for all of us. For your "nice guy" neighbor, when the price of groceries and gas go up, look him in the eye and say " This is what you voted for." Trump supporters need to be held personally accountable for the chaos to come. If your "nice guy" neighbor is shocked at what actually happens in mass deportations of people, simply remind him and all like him you know who supported Trump "THIS IS WHAT YOU VOTED FOR."
YES! (Rick Wilson, a former top Republican strategist who became a leader in the Never-Trumpers and The Lincoln Project said recently, "You Democrats just don't get it. You have to be MEAN. Here. I'll show you how." And boy! did he ever!)
Would agree that its important to respond to people who are speaking trumpisms.
What I've noticed is that protrumpers want you to be upset; and when I'm not and respond with facts, it seems to stop them. Not that they believe anything I say. I don't engage their anger, I respond to what they say, firmly, at times.
Excellent advice, Meg!
Adding to Bob's comment. People who are depriving you of your freedoms, infringing on your happiness and peace of mind, are not your friends. They may be citizens of the US. That doesn't mean that we owe them respect or consideration, especially when they show none to us. Don't degrade your beliefs or your value system just to avoid a confrontation. In short, don't go along to get along. It never has and never will work against people who simply don't care what you think.
I intend to do just that.
Yes! I am spending some time today crying and shouting and feeling all the feels. But, I will use all of this as motivation to speak up and when his supporters feel the consequences of their vote, I will most definitely point out that this is exactly what they wanted. Elections have consequences and according to Elon, everyone will experience economic hardships as they gut the government and rebuild it, so those voters will not escape it either.
Addendum: Rick is so sick at heart over the results of the election that he has not been able to write his substack. He had such high hopes that the Never Trumpers and The Lincoln Project would help us succeed.
You can't fix stupid. The stupid is too big and strong.
Huh.
I have that neighbor too!
So you and I must be neighbors and not know it.....
LOL
Unfortunately so. They're more afraid of a smart black woman than they are the "Haitian cat eating queer illegal drug trafficking immigrants." Wherever they might be.
Several Black men that I work with said the same thing
Maybe patriarchy even trumps racism...
Robert, I would call it misogyny
Shirley Chisholm thought the same.
American society has not made social progress. Trump more than encouraged white supremist to publicly have their way. All those rebel flags just take us back to the days of slavery and hating every nationality of immigrant entering our country, as well as hating Native Americans and stealing their land.
A WOMAN!!! PERIOD!
It looks to me like the male candidates for the house are defeating the women…
Exactly!
Around the corner from me (where Harris-Walz signs line the street, is a guy with many large Trump flags, including one of Trump being held by Secret Service when he was shot, and one of "Farmers For Trump" (!). I haven't made his acquaintance....
At least HE admitted his bigotry! Most of them just continued the tired "it's the economy" schtick. Why can I easily find articles reporting that our economy is NOT in bad shape now? President Biden really DID improve things! Is the entire Internet set up to only show each of us what we want to see? (I know Facebook is, but Google, too? Because when I Google for info about the state of the economy, I get many headlines stating it's the envy of other major nations! WTF???) I actually had an argument with someone who told me that Jerome Powell probably lied....because he's a Democrat! The man whose JOB is to track and report on the State of the Economy of this nation was being called biased by my FRIEND (he's basically a relative so I can't end the relationship).
So they put all of the shameful, embarrassing, divisive remarks that POS made into their brain's garbage disposal and said the economy was better before Biden - at FIRST, it was, since Biden had to fix what his lunatic predecessor and COVID did. But Bidenomics WORKED....and he'll NEVER get documented credit for that...or for anything he accomplished, I guess. His own supporters laugh at him now, which breaks my heart.
Yes....maybe if Biden's VP looked like JD Vance we could have won over more Republicans for a minute. Then I'd have been happy to kick them back into their holes and gutters.
😢😩
Some of them are my family members who are in church every Sunday.
Sitting in church listening to bigotry being preached?
Many of the mega churches preach politics instead of teaching the New Testament "And the greatest of these is love."
In no way does that make them "Godly."
Being in church every Sunday
Yep
I don’t like feeling this way, but I still do.
Ditto. Absolutely heart sick.
Ditto ditto. I am actually sick. I have a bad knee and I had an internal bleed this morning Fortunately my ortho doc was able to squeeze me into his schedule and drained it for me. Can stress actually cause that? Dunno.
I wish you were my neighbors. I am surrounded too, family, neighbors, congregants who are big DT supporters. I feel more at peace here among strangers with like minds. What’s up with that?
Me too, but let's not stop trying, because when we do, we become a mirror of their hate. I do not believe you can fight hatred with hatred, and I am endeavoring not to fall into that trap. It is a trap, but it is seductive. Our country is heading in this direction because people have begun to feel comfortable with hatred, which has been reigned on them from Rush Limbaugh, to Alex Jones to J.D. Vance. Do not get comfortable with it.
Fuck my neighbors is where I am. I'm not religious. I'm not called to love my idiot neighbors who only care about themselves. Fuck 'em.
My neighbors aren't the problem. There were plenty of Harris/Walz and Brown signs and no Trump or Moreno signs in my neighborhood.
Kathy. Think about what you just said.
Your neighbors may be fine. I live in a small Texas rural town. MY neighbors are the problem.. They're very genteel. No yard signs at all. Yet they are MAGA to the core.
Vote counts are a more reliable measure. I live in an area outside Louisville that often splits the vote & voted down the anti-abortion amendment. But it hasn’t changed its voting for a GOP president since Bill Clinton. The few signs in the area were 3:1 Harris / Walz.
In the very red western rural part of the state last week we only saw 2 trump signs. But state voting results were 2% more for trump than 2020.
I was thinking more in the abstract, as in "Love they neighbors as thyself".
I’m not even trying. They will get what they deserve, but unfortunately, we will get what they deserve as well. They can all go to hell.
Me too. I watch for little opportunities to be kind to those who don't expect it. let someone ahead in line, hold the door for the next person. It primes the pump for the passing of grace which heals.
Excellent point. Haven't gotten there yet.
So am I!🤬🤬🤬🤬
I respectfully disagree with Judd here. This isn't just America right now. This is America. It likely always was and the mythology we told ourselves about this country appears to be just that. A myth. There may be a subset of us in this nation who do hold and live up to lofty ideals, but other than the handful of times this nation pulled itself from the brink at the last possible moment, it repeatedly shows its core values.
We've gone back to the 1920s when this country was ruled by a few extremely wealthy white men. And the 1920s ended in the Great Depression. That's where we are going.
The retrograde ride is still picking up speed. This country is headed to a time earlier than 1920, but now it has automatic weapons, jets and nuclear weapons packed for the trip.
Sadly I fear you are correct.
And that's how we will come out of this.
I suspect you may be more correct on this matter, than I'd like to admit; though the last several years I've been loosing heart for America/ Americans & think about moving overseas, where it's perhaps less personal for me. Too much willful ignorance. Too many folks imo, are unable " to see the forest through the trees, " nor understand the potential for unintended consequences built into some of these choices. Too many that don't appear to care about their fellow humans in any significant way.
Stay here and work for our Public Education System. We need more well-educated Americans. If a good education was not available for the tRump voters, it's not THEIR fault. It's that we were not paying close attention when our tax dollars went to religious schools.
The old Thomas Zimmer argument. I concur. In the coming 250th year of the Union, will we the nation learn to atone and move past the original sins of the Natives’ extermination, and chattel slavery? Will we learn to keep defending democracy while safely dismantling our empire abroad? Will we embrace our destiny as a vibrant, pluralistic democracy in all spheres of life, ‘achieving our country’, as Richard Rorty put it? A small part of me wonders
Thanks for pointing me in his direction. This article I just read from him was prescient.
https://open.substack.com/pub/thomaszimmer/p/it-could-definitely-happen-here?r=ckwco&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
In a couple of months the government will own your cell phone,computer and your tv.
And after that, if you're a menstruating girl or women, they will use the monitor which is currently being used in China (I was astounded to learn that such a thing actually exists) to keep track of your periods.
Handmaid's Tale
Well, should we all go back to using our cell phones for talking, not keeping all our records. Wipe them clean, just talk on the phone to live people.
Yes, Polly we should. Never in 78 years did I need a computer stuck to my ass to find a bathroom or to get a date.
Land lines, like humans need to be held and talked to.
Big government and BIG business closely linked! It’s called fascism . Chris must know this???? Big corporations already own you through your use of cell phones, computers, etc.
Edward Snowden told the American public years ago. But, no , destroy the person who tried to alarm us against our own government spying on us. We have been stupid for a very long time.
Edward living in exile in Russia!!!! Make a trade… all of MAGA for one Edward Snowden.
And we are left to wonder which of our lesser-known neighbors support fascism.
I do too!
DEPRESSED, DEVASTATED, SHOCKED AND EXTREMELY SAD.
SAME.... BUT I AM A BRIT...I FEEL FOR YOU AND FEAR FOR YOU,YOUR COUNYTY AND THE ENTIRE WORLD UNDER THESE AUSPICES!!!
Yes, what happened today will endanger your nation, too. Once the orange sadist pulls us out of NATO, and turns Ukraine over to his pal Pukin, all of Europe becomes endangered starting first with the Eastern European nations.
Biden needs to get Ukraine every weapon he can.
Biden needs to take the Immunity of prosecution thing very seriously. At least go down swinging.
Yes! Yes! Yes! (Suggestions about anything that we, as citizens, can do to at least get it out on the table?)
Excellent point! Shall we write him? Speak up while we still can, because we all know that in the very near future, our voices won't be heard (if we even still have our voices.)
Yes, and fast.
I am very worried about that exact scenario.
Yes, Aileen, these devastating results will reverberate around the world and affect everyone on many levels for years to come. This is simply gut-wrenching. I’m at a complete loss.
Me, too. Keep your leaders in check so this cancer doesn't spread any more than it has.
Thank you ... we're going to need ALL THE HELP WE CAN GET!!!
Aileen. Your compassion for us USA truly makes me cry😭😭😭
PLEASE DO NOT CRY. You are brave. ENTIRE WORLD IS WITH YOU.
Not brave right now. Terrified.
Will Russian. Intervention be investigated And Elon Musk ??Biden is still President?
I am wondering why world leaders are congratulating T***p but not Putin.
Highly doubt it. There is no more accountability.
What will the sentencing be in the case against him that he lost?
As for the other things they will probably be swept under the carpet.
"what case"
We'll never hear another word about that.
C'mon, you know his first act as president will be to pardon himself and erase all sign of any wrong doing! Then the purge will begin of all who have wronged him in any way. Hang on to your hats, the whirlwind of retribution and revenge is just beginning.
I wonder if/when he'll be sending his goon squad out to get Colbert and Kimmel?
oh, no... !!
State Convictions can NOT be Pardoned by the Prez …
WOW I WONDER IF THIS WILL HOLD?
I stand corrected because in the first two weeks of his new presidency he has already attempted to fire all of the people associated with his prosecution.
Again, he is literally keeping promises to himself of retribution because his ego is more important than the people he “serves” as president! He needs to stop blaming others and start doing the correct things for the whole country.
I seriously doubt he gets anything other than a light probation. The state of NY is not going to put Trump in jail when he needs to be available for the transition. The federal cases will go bye-bye, the GA case might proceed without him. A sitting president can't be prosecuted.
These were probably among his biggest incentives... to stay out of jail and to self-pardon!
First & foremost … living in the WH was an afterthought.
This guy has gotten away with EVERTHING his entire life!! What is THAT about, God? What are you trying to tell us?
Is there still a God?
No🤣
You're so funny I forgot to laugh! (Remember that from when we were kids?)
Is the world flat?
With the turtle speed at which Garland worked for J6 etc and the other election interference stuff, don’t bet on it.
I keep thinking that it's just a bad dream, and that I'll wake up from it. How could it truly have happened????
Racism, hate, etc still exist strongly in our Country, and tRump had that as his calling card. It’s such a sad day in our Country.
along with misogyny, selfishness and terribly undereducated
Me too, but worse. Glad I’m old.
I’m not. I don’t want to see my daughters and granddaughters suck or dying bc they’re denied simple pregnancy interventions
I don’t want to be poor and destitute in my old age - I was planning on SS, Medicare and anything that can be done for the middle class
Agree. I’m 62 and won’t be around when all the shit that’s going to happen truly bears fruit in the next two decades. But I worry about my 21-year-old daughter and what the U.S. will be like when she’s 40.
I bet it won’t take two decades.
Richard. I too feel glad I’m old but so many in my family are not😭😭😭
Yup … but really am concerned for my Wife and kids
Rich. Exactly my feelings.
Keep it up, Popular Information. We’re all going to need you in the next few years.
I feel let down. I didn't think that America was this racist, hateful or destructive to its own people. They have no idea what they have unleashed because eggs were expensive.
I quit eating eggs in 1986. The price of eggs does not affect me. However, the knowledge of what happens to ALL the male chicks in the hatcheries, and the horrible lives the hens live, affects me greatly. How ridiculous it has been for me to ever think for one minute that people would care about chickens when.. as we see today… people won’t even care about people. 💔
I raise my own hens, eat and sell the eggs, and live among many others who do the same... and who voted for Harris. Rural residents all, in a blessedly, mostly blue state. Have you seen any acknowledgement that we exist??? Or only the sterotype of rural, red America?
I know the hens come from hatcheries, where the males are either suffocated in big plastic bags, or tossed into a grinder. On their first and only day of life.
We don’t need eggs. We can leave chickens alone.
Kelly Jean, I feel the exact same way. I don't eat friggin' bacon and eggs. I care more about the animals, they are the pure souls on this earth. Now it'll be open season on them all and the destruction of the planet is now beginning. The extinction of humanity is a strong possibility. I'm thinking, maybe it's a good thing.
I now have had my lifelong intuitions come to fruition, the knowledge that the majority of people, in this country particularly, are ignorant, cruel bastards who worship money and nothing else. I don't like the feeling of needing to vomit every minute of the day, but I keep feeling like I'm going to puke, without stopping. 🤮😭
Thank you, Diane. The root of ALL of this, is lack of compassion, whether directed towards humans or animals.
Once you get to the point where you think it’s ok for animals to be raised in slavery and sent to slaughterhouses, is it really that far of a jump to think it’s ok to get rid of SOME people? I think the line is very thin.
I agree. Do they think covid inflation wouldn't have happened under Trump? Biden's agenda brought the country out faster than any other nation. Wait until the new tariffs are inactive. Inflation will go through the roof. He also wants to control the Fed. Great, just like his companies. We're in for a deep crisis.
I have a feeling that the tariffs won't be put on anything because he knows it's a losing proposition. It was something said to garner votes. Now that he has won, much of the stuff he promised won't happen, but it will be too late for all of us. I feel like I'm on a roller coaster that has not been inspected or maintained for years. You hope all will go okay, but are waiting for the first broken rail or collapsing support beam to fail, yet the operator just upped the speed and broke the brakes.
This is true. Food costs are about to crush us due to racism.
Agreed. Everything he touches turns to sh*t. Now it'll be the country that gets bankrupted.
"think" may be the operative word there...
...and right there, Susan, is the problem. Democrats have a messaging problem, and Americans have a listening problem.
I don’t believe Dems have a messaging problem. Look at how mainstream media obsessed about Biden’s age but not trump’s. They didn’t go into all the good Biden did while ignoring and normalizing all the bad trump’s doing. Those billionaires sold out the working class. trump supporters will suffer like us but they’ll be happy to see Hispanic’s deported - regardless of their legal status
There will be a lot of people who voted Trump who will find themselves swept up in ICE raids. Even though they’re citizens.
Somewhere in the back of my mind I saw this as if it had to happen, but rejected it in the belief that humanity would win out. Now it's like watching some terrible tragedy happen in slow motion.
I'm heartsick, for my daughter who will now choose not to have children due to the fear of what could happen in a high risk pregnancy. Even more so for her many friends who she worked with in childcare, DACA immigrants who fear they will either be separated from their children when they are deported or who must take their children to live somewhere foreign to them. In my own family, my 93 year old father, who supported Trump does not believe that kind of cruelty truly exists. My sister, who supported out of a self-righteous belief that she everything he says is true based only on her "pro-life" indignation doesn't realize what could happen to her Hispanic husband and children.
Can you kindly remind me of what the Dem's message actually was? It seems not to have made a strong enough impression to change the minds of about 5M people...
The Dems didn't read the room (populace). Rerunning the same candidate was a tactical error. Pivoting to Harris at the last minute was a tactical error. Not having a primary (which would have had to happen much earlier than July) was a tactical error. Running on abortion rights (which I strongly believe in) was an error (Trump's position was that it was now in the hands of the states, and many put it on the ballot - if I was Repub I could vote for abortion rights and vote against Harris in many states).
I'm not trying to be unkind, but the Dems really didn't position the party in a winning way...It sucks to going backward and I (like pretty much all here) am scared.
What was the Dem message? Based on Harris's speeches, I'd say she was quite consistent on ...
Building an "opportunity economy" that helps YOU achieve YOUR goals. Specifically, if you want a family, here's tax incentives and policies. If you want to buy a home, here's a program to lower costs for you and build more houses. If you want to start a business, here's a program. And for everyone, going after price gouging, cutting medical costs and protecting worker's rights.
Now, I get that doesn't fit on a stamp like "MAGA", which is vague promises about unicorns if we just get rid of migrants and raise taxes.
But I thought it was adults who vote, not gullible children. Guess I was wrong.
I agree! donald saying abortion is decided by the states and that’s supposedly enough to satisfy abortion rights advocates? Get real.
donald’s voters have been proven to be low information voters who believe his lies and soak up the disinformation on mainstream media and SM like Xitter.
I think Democrats’ problem is less the messaging and more owning the mighty propaganda machines ( and the will to use them with regard only for power, not truth)
Bullseye! The medium is the message - and the medium is controlled by the billionaires...
...either the right wingers who want a christofascist nation or the bothsiders who normalized this.
They created the stupidity that put egg prices and criminal convictions on the same playing field, stripped of context.
I suspect disapproval of being shushed and threatened for protesting an ethnic cleansing and a genocide has more to do with this than eggs. Let's see how many registered Democrats sat out this election as compared to 2020, because that is going to reveal how impressed the rank and file are with their DNC operatives. When you up the ante of "lesser evil" to backing a genocide, that really does confuse a voter over what is "lesser." Independents turned out more than either party.
You're absolutely right that Biden voters stayed home - and that was the key difference.
But, I'm sorry to disagree on the "genocide" argument. It never occurred to me to abandong the only candidate demanding a ceasefire and two-state solution because I don't think their tactic was agressive enough.
America has now made her choice. Let's see how long it takes until we miss the Biden policy of diplomatic pressure.
Like you, I didn't make the choice to abandon what I saw as the only hope we had to avoid being ruled under a resurrected Confederate States of America, but I know those who could not bring themselves to support the genocide by lending their vote to give approval either. To call them "bothsiders" is a terribly shallow fabrication that trivializes the role the Democratic Party operatives took in bringing us both to being party to a genocide and installing Trump a second time. They followed their 2016 playbook to a T (no pun intended) and produced an even worse result.
So under trump they will see Gaza turned to glass or something equally awful. Not so smart.
Those who follow more than mainstream media, as we both do, will agree on your assessment that Trump will be worse. Indeed, BOTH parties fell all over themselves trying to curry favor with Netanyahu, but only one held Presidential power so only one (1!) was seen and experienced by American citizens as being too weak to stand up to him. Cripes! Biden and Blinken were willing to let him run our universities, govern our citizens with "loyalty oaths" to the Israeli government in 38 states, and advocate for lethal force being used on OUR children, not Israeli kids, who protested a genocide on our college campuses. That should NOT sit well with any American who is made furious by being called "antisemitic" for saying we will not be governed by Netanyahu. A party who pulls that s--t, and the Democratic Party DID DO THAT is going to lose votes. 13 million fewer Democrats voted for their party in 2024 than in 2020.
A confirmation is AOC's New York district that went overwhelmingly for Trump as their President AND for AOC as their Representative, knowing FULL WELL that the operatives of the Democratic Party--the same Democratic Party corporate mob wanting Lina Khan fired -- also want AOC and the "Squad" GONE as badly as the Republican corporate mob wants them gone. The people, when seeing some semblance of an option, aren't supporting the corporate mob. A vote for Trump and for AOC is clearly a vote of people fed up with this Democratic Party as run by its operatives.
Great question 🤔
Blaming media is too easy and won’t help us win next time. We need to look in the mirror, and figure out WHY people chose to vote the way the did. And if the glaring deficiencies of Trump couldn’t sway them, what would have?
Good question but looking at that clown at his last few rallies should have been enough for any person with 2-3 operational brain cells to see he is not qualified!!!
His followers never looked at any live stream of Trump's incoherent rallies. The regular media did not play up the rallies to show Trumps meandering, incoherent, violent rhetoric. Most all were available on YouTube. Sadly, the average person does absolutely no research for facts or the truth.
What would sway them? A white male candidate! The majority of people in this country are obviously very racist and very very misogynistic.
So very sad about this truth.
The fact that men under 30 helped Trump win shows that it is not just old men either.
It is young and old men. White, black and hispanic. They all chose a criminal over a woman.
Right! They lined up with the racists because I guess in their marginalized minds, even a rapist, racist crook suffering from dementia is better than a woman! So now the simpletons got their way. I'm not going to ask "what's next."
Not that this helps us but the blame is squarely on the R party. They were too cowardly to not assign guilt in the impeachments. They supported all trump's bad behavior. They nominated him and helped him get elected. They are bad humans only seeking money and power
Americans were pissed enough at both parties to blow it all up so they did so. We are now all going to experience what life would be like had the Confederate States of America triumphed.
Yes, I've often thought of this as the Civil War, part 2
It seems the sentiments of the aristocratic Old South - Divine Right- ie education for the white and rich, control by the white and rich, because god is white and rich. Those sentiments just “won” the Civil War. Even more thoroughly than any contemporary Confederate could have hoped. Not overnight, but to the bone.
Susan...you have quite nailed a big portion of it. They will suffer
And I hope they suffer greatly for their abject stupidity.
Nancy F, I agree. I hope every last one of them lives in pure misery every single day. I've never hated anyone before. I hate now, I have nothing but contempt for them all. They can ALL go straight to hell where they belong.
You don't DESTROY a country just because "waaaa😭, I'm not seen or heard enough, waaaa 😭" .......oh, my groceries are too expensive! I'll vote for a treasonous, ignorant bastard who's also a convicted FELON, that will definitely make life better. 🤬
I'm angry, very angry. I'm disgusted with the level of stupidity in this country. I'm also very very profoundly sad. Fuck them all. Every single one of those Maga maggots.
If it's ok to belittle and ridicule people, then fine, I'm speaking my mind about those red mofo's. I repeat, FUCK THEM ALL. 😢
Exactly what I keep saying!
Or gas prices were high…
Except they WEREN'T!
Actually, the prices went up in the oil state where I was. Not necessary, just making a point. Now, they can say that Trump brought them down.
I'm scared shitless that they really will enact Gilead. And I don't understand how he actually got the popular vote!?!
Because this country will never elect a woman. No matter how bad the man is.
The comments I heard from Black and Latino men absolutely BLEW MY MIND! "Women are too emotional." WTF??? Who is writing those ALL CAPS Untruth Sociopathic posts all night long with dozens of exclamations points?! (sort of like I'm doing now. Oh. I just realized I'm a woman. That probably explains it. No. Wait. the orange sadist is NOT a woman -- so far as we know -- so men can be emotional, too. Right? Hello, guys? Right?)
Those men are just projecting. That's why they love Cheetolini
Ah! Bingo! I've been aware of Cheetolini (love it!)'s projection since Day 1. (Most primitive defense mechanism, according to Freud). Somehow I never extended that to include his FaithFul Follwers. Thanks for the insight.
That’s DARVO. Deny. Attack. Reverse Victim and Offender.
We’re going to see domestic violence against women and children go way up.
I hate it, but I fear that you are right. Not only will domestic violence increase. I suspect that the policing of it will go way down.
As if the Chumpalumpagus isn’t driven purely by his emotions/ego? Insane.
Great name!
There are no words to explain it … only tears this morning.
Sadly we are still a racist sexist nation
On the other hand, next year I may be able to buy myself a black woman! (Sarcasm)
So insane that I'm shaking my head and laughing! (But WILL it stay insane?)
Which blows my mind. As a white male in his fifties, I. DO. NOT. GET. THIS.
Yep, the shit-losing that happened when we elected a Black man should have been a warning flare.
What?
Do you not remember the collective shit-fit that the white males had when Obama was elected?
Today's America if full of aggrieved white males. And yes .. it started when a fair election elected Obama. It unleashed the white supremacists and then Trump gave them permission to do anything they wanted.
Indeed. And it galls me to hear people say that “racism is solved, we’ve had a Black president”
Ahh. Sure. I first misinterpreted your comment. Now I get it and agree.
I should have been more verbose.
Susan that's a huge portion of it...sadly. America is no longer a shining light on the hill 😪
Was it ever?
Sadly too true. Look at the "landmark" of 2 Black women in the Senate at the same time... among how many women thete is total? Certainly not the 50 percent of the population that is female.
You must be right ... sadly
I don’t live in the USA, but am fearful for the entire world
We’re in similar boats.
Us, too.
Really down, cannot believe more than half of the American people, and over 60%of the people in Florida where I live bought the bull$hit he was selling. Once a conman, always a conman.😭😭
Fellow Floridian. They didn't buy his BS, they know he was lying and they don't care. His persona (a cult if you will) is based on scapegoating those that are different. Every "issue" can be traced back to a different group to blame
You nailed it with cult...
Another fellow Floridian here. I was so hopeful that Florida might go blue this time. I never imagined Trump would win like this or at all. My whole family voted for Kamala.
Putin’s puppet has killed the USA. I’m devastated.
Truth.
I am so disappointed that stupidity, racism, misogynism, and fascism is now a feature of American politics, not a bug. I will fight this.
I agree with you. I am mourning - devastated and shocked but I will not give up.
It is stupidity, racism, misogynism, fascism *and rage* ...all carefully cultivated by a media that is built to entertain or radicalize, not inform.
This. Between Fox News and targeted internet ads/feeds/exploitation...
I’m hoping that you can
A: Betrayed by my fellow citizens. Apparently, they can only learn the truth through severe pain. Wish they didn’t have to drag the rest of us through it. Very hard not to be furious at them. Idiots.
They are really not going to like the results of those tariffs.
If it was only that! What about RFK removing fluoride from drinking water, no more mandatory or federally funded vaccines? And that is just the well known things. Then there is the elimination of the Department of Education! A long time dream of many. And Elon Musk in charge of cleaning up the budget. Say goodbye to SSA helping disabled people. And who knows what he will do to the elderly. The Dept of Justice will be under the direction of the President. No more separation of church and state. It just goes on and on. .
Susan Guyaux, don't forget, they plan to repeal HEALTH-CARE for the entire nation. So all those bacon and eggs eaters can die from their diseases because they won't have any health insurance. But boy, they could then afford to get more bacon with the orange Mussolini running the show! Disgusting. 😞
The genocide was a factor. But will never understand how anyone could support such a hideous idiot.
Gaza had some influence, but not too much. We all know it won't be any different under Trump. Harris won both the Jewish and Muslim majority. However Christians turned out big time for Trump.
RFK in charge of anything is dangerous .. he fried his brain as a long term drug user.
Good. Whatever it takes.
Lowest day in our nation’s history…….
I feel a sense of terror of the unknown upcoming. we no longer have any guardrails to protect us
I found out yesterday cheap gas is more important than our children’s future, that misogyny goes beyond race, that one’s personal comfort means hating the less fortunate, that being considerate to those different than you is an affront to freedom, that most people will do anything to make themselves feel bigger and stronger by tearing down the less fortunate and the marginalized. America has chosen a rapist, a con man, a racist, and a misogynist - we can no longer deny who we are as a people.
My heart is broken 💔
Well said. Sad but true.
That's ridiculous. Every Red state has Democrats who voted for Kamala. You expect they can just move to California? Calling all *those people* maggots is not compassionate or productive.
Nancy Orr, it's my opinion. Trump's minions (and trump himself )weren't compassionate nor productive so don't preach to anyone about that. Apparently you've not seen the recent Wired news report about what, exactly, the CULT of MAGA are saying in their posts about ALL Democrats and Kamala etc.etc. go read it and then lecture about compassion and productivity.
Yeah, I know every red state has those who voted for Kamala . If immigrant people can be selectively deported from any state, then so can those red voters. The very people who wouldn't think twice about tossing YOU off a building.
Devastated. Speechless. No words.
There are "friends" I won't look at the same, knowing they voted for hate, division, racism, misogyny, homophobia... What's worse, is we'll be stuck with JD soon.
Or maybe, you could ask them why they voted the way they did, and I can almost guarantee you it wasn't for any of those reasons. Being stuck with JD is not worse than those things, what those things actually are. The fact that you say so suggests that they're incorporeal bogeymen, not the subjects of real experience, otherwise you wouldn't such a comparison. You act like hate, division, racism, misogyny, and homophobia are self-evident attributes of Trump. Which is harder to believe, that 71 million people (a significant portion of which are minorities) voted out of hateful, divisive, racist, misogynistic, homophobic bigotry, or that perhaps they don't see things the way you do? If you talk to them, you might also find out how much they all hate of those things too, and not the trivial things that get slapped with those labels all the time and drain the words of any meaningful significance.