What a heroic study of our tax system Judd and Tesnim have provided for us! No change in my appreciation for brilliant Elizabeth Warren ["Tax. The. Rich."] and revulsion for the greediest man in the Senate, Joe Manchin. And what an appropriate name for the Senator who fights to keep poor children food insecure while increasing tax benefits for corporations (many of whom are price gougers)--Crapo! I will share this article happily.
Meanwhile American leaders, media shrug and act like *there is nothing we can do* about income inequality, crumbling infrastructure etc etc when there is a simple solution that worked before in the US and works in other wealthy countries. Its beyond infuriating.
I am especially interested in the actual filing process. I don’t think anyplace causes the anxiety the US does. The “gubbermint” already has access to all the data on every taxpayer, how about they just send an invoice or the rebate so we aren’t all doing the “administrativa”? It’s a little bit like self-checkouts! 😎
Oh wow, I had not seen that before, thank you; that’s gold. When I first saw it was from the NYT, I expected a paywall. I’d like to propagate that link.
Who would ever vote for a republican? There aren't that many wealthy families in America so how are all these 'elected officials' in the pocket of corporations?
I suspect that many American families think that they are simply one "how to get rich quick" scheme or airport seminar away from joining the 0.0001% themselves, and until then must preserve those chances by emulating the lead of the billionaire class, including selecting candidates for elective office.
I think that a quote, attributed to John Steinbeck, indirectly gets at this question:
"Socialism never took root in America because the poor there see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires".
"Who would vote for Republicans?" Too many people that have been subjected to a lot of propaganda. The billionaires took Lewis Powell's advice seriously and have done a very good job of winning over many people with their skullduggery. Russia has helped a lot lately as well.
Great reporting and important information—as if most Americans will ever pay attention. Another not-so-minor item to mention is that the über-wealthy use another time-honored method to avoid taxation, which is to borrow against their accumulated capital and, thus, never get taxed on that capital since it’s never “sold.” Musk is perhaps the best exemplar of that phenomenon. His official pay at Tesla is $1/year, but since all his wealth is in stock, he can readily borrow as much as he needs without ever paying capital-gains taxes. If average Americans could only be taught to see how we’re all being swindled I would like to think that Bernie’s and Warren’s proposals for a modest wealth tax (1% per year for a billionaire? Are you kidding me? As if that would change Musk’s lifestyle?!) makes so much sense. Personally, I’d rather see billionaires go away entirely. How much money do you need to live on? The only thing it does to have such wealth sloshing around at the top is to severely distort our politics and influence-peddling in general—oh, and leave tens of millions of Americans, including millions of children, below the poverty line. As today’s GOP mantra goes, “Cruelty IS the point.”
Judd & Tesmin, thanks again for making me mad whilst I enjoy my morning coffee! Oh, don’t get me wrong, I love you, but you have this tendency to pull the curtain back and reveal the worst among us! Our economy and government lives on a steady diet of greed and corruption. I’m not sure if there’s a way to fix it, short of allowing it to fail. But revealing the facts and exposing the lies and deceit is a monumental step in the right direction, and you do that on a daily/weekly basis! I often recall the words of Lord Axton (1887) “Power tends to corrupt, absolute power corrupts absolutely.” The next line in this quote attributed to Axton is “Great men are almost always bad men…” Can you be a great person without being a bad person? Hmmm.
Amen, except "I’m not sure if there’s a way to fix it, short of allowing it to fail"--that would be worse. The remedy would be to elect viable Democrat majorities in the House and the Senate...and of course the Presidency. Can you imagine the laws that could be changed for the better of the majority of we the people?
Dems have had congressional majorities before and in recent memory. Do they use them to good effect? Unhappily, they ignore some very critical problems like voting accessibility, dark money in politics, tax fairness, climate and environmental health, cyber security, the filibuster, gerymandering, and other issues. Could it be because they are as intertwined with corporate and Wall Street interests as is the GOP?
IMHO, and to be fair, in recent memory, two DINO Senators Joe Manchin, and Kyrsten Lea Sinema diluted the Senate majority. And inspection of publically accessible Congressional voting records still reflects a significant emphasis between the two parties. Based upon voting records, The GOP is, by far, sock-puppets of the Corporatocracy.
Because of the money in politics (thanks to SCOTUS, in no small way) the Billionaires, Corporatists & their hired lobbyists continue to bastardize the way our system is designed. Just like Wall Street hates uncertainty, the billionaire class seems to prefer to maintain the status quo because it is that status quo that they believe is necessary to insulate their wealth from "progress" whose unknown consequences might threaten their kingdoms of money. So, I suspect that they LUV when there are ongoing imbalances between House, Senate & WH and the resulting gridlock.
If voters want real change, vote the Dems a 60 seat Senate majority, and enough seats in the House to override a veto, AND a Democrat President in his second term who is then insulated from the demands of another campaign ... and then ring Bernie Sanders and ask him to come to the WH with his entire wishlist. ;-)
Whenever a particular industry voices adamant opposition to a government program that’s designed to help lower income people, we can be certain that they are afraid of the competition. Consequently, their arguments against the proposal will be biased and “spun” (if not outright lies). Just look at the opposition to CFPB and FTC (and White House) efforts to reduce closing costs for homebuyers, led by the American Land Title Association and its members. Whatever they (or the tax prep industry) say, believe the opposite.
Love Elizabeth Warren's determination to hold these bad players accountable. Hate that my senator is Mike Crapo. My apologies. Red state Idaho would elect a dead rat as long as there is an R behind the name on the ballot.
Here in Florida, Jimmy Patronis is yammering that the Free IRS is intrusive and would be another way the "gubbermint" can spy on you. This guy is the CFO in Florida and their whole schtick is to blast the Federal Govt because it resonates with the Rednecks. Jimmy is an idiot! They do nothing in Florida to help the lower income or less fortunate. It's all about helping Pulte, Mosaic, Citadel, and all the other Right Wing Rich. SAD!! Jimmy wrongly states that people might forget to file their state income tax. News Flash JUMBO, there is no Florida State Income Tax. Buffoon!!
These are names of those who would see children starve: Joe, Mike and Chuck. Hmmm... I think they are all crap-o.
My 24 yo daughter tried the IRS filing system for three days and could not get anywhere, finally giving up on the morning of April 15th. She then turned to Intuit which I warned her would probably cost money and be as confusing as the IRS filing system. Guess what? It wasn't as complicated and she was deemed a freebie! The government's action against the prevaricating TurboTax musta worked because I don't think they want to give away anything.
As far as the unfair tax system, we know who to blame: Ronnie, Georgie and Donnie come to mind.
Reports such as this one always provokes wonder. For example, I wonder what effect revising the government revenue, i.e., tax code, to a flat tax system would have on politics? There would certainly be a ripple effect through industries that have evolved to profit from the progressive tax system and it's ridiculous complexity. At the same time, what would happen to all the money spent to pad election campaign coffers by corporations and individuals looking for big layoffs from tax avoidance?
Oh my. Did you actually say that? A flat tax system would be the ultimate win for the rich, who would then cut every program they couldn't eliminate. Note: low income people pay very low tax rates. That's because they have to eat. Personal and corporate tax rates are already essentially flat, given the low maximum rates in place and the endless ways the rich get around paying taxes at all. And Social Security tax is actually regressive, as the flat rates do not apply to incomes above a very low threshold. You think we have progressive taxation now? Think again.
Yes, I did say that. I was actually using flat tax as a placeholder for anything other than the current system as opposed to being a fanatical supporter of that approach. Happy you got something to latch onto this morning. I believe my overall point still bears out though.
I understand your proposition. My comment points out the insanity of the flat tax and the failure of the insufficiently progressive system we have. Progressive taxation is sane, not fanatical. The fanatics want to institute the flat tax.
Thanks for this. We tax too little and thus spend too little on things like supporting families. American government spends just 0.7% of GDP on family support compare to 3-4 times that of our peer countries.
I wrote a post, below, called "An Open Message To The Top 0.1%" that addresses some aspects of economic inequality.
Re Grassley and Tillis statements. If only these folks could listen and really hear the drivel that spews from their mouths! What if what the President is doing really IS good and helps many Americans. What if those people helped are their constituents? If their only purpose being a legislator is to further their now totally defunct party...you get the picture. Vote them OUT.
Day after day, week after week, month after month, the litany of greed and self-dealing among the GOP and the rich is disgusting. I am beyond tired of reading about it. For people who'd like a lot of data on how the system is financially rigged, check out the new book by Matthew Desmond, Poverty, By America.
What a heroic study of our tax system Judd and Tesnim have provided for us! No change in my appreciation for brilliant Elizabeth Warren ["Tax. The. Rich."] and revulsion for the greediest man in the Senate, Joe Manchin. And what an appropriate name for the Senator who fights to keep poor children food insecure while increasing tax benefits for corporations (many of whom are price gougers)--Crapo! I will share this article happily.
Meanwhile American leaders, media shrug and act like *there is nothing we can do* about income inequality, crumbling infrastructure etc etc when there is a simple solution that worked before in the US and works in other wealthy countries. Its beyond infuriating.
I would love to see that break down. I know that I. Denmark upper earners are paying between 50 to 70% in taxes. It may be even higher for their few
I am especially interested in the actual filing process. I don’t think anyplace causes the anxiety the US does. The “gubbermint” already has access to all the data on every taxpayer, how about they just send an invoice or the rebate so we aren’t all doing the “administrativa”? It’s a little bit like self-checkouts! 😎
if you haven't seen this it gets into that: https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000009030739/irs-intuit-tax-season.html
Oh wow, I had not seen that before, thank you; that’s gold. When I first saw it was from the NYT, I expected a paywall. I’d like to propagate that link.
The ‘administrivia’ of the US filing process is a little like self-checkouts.
Who would ever vote for a republican? There aren't that many wealthy families in America so how are all these 'elected officials' in the pocket of corporations?
I suspect that many American families think that they are simply one "how to get rich quick" scheme or airport seminar away from joining the 0.0001% themselves, and until then must preserve those chances by emulating the lead of the billionaire class, including selecting candidates for elective office.
I think that a quote, attributed to John Steinbeck, indirectly gets at this question:
"Socialism never took root in America because the poor there see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires".
"Who would vote for Republicans?" Too many people that have been subjected to a lot of propaganda. The billionaires took Lewis Powell's advice seriously and have done a very good job of winning over many people with their skullduggery. Russia has helped a lot lately as well.
As usual, the Rich get Richer, and the rest of us are S C R E W E D
Great reporting and important information—as if most Americans will ever pay attention. Another not-so-minor item to mention is that the über-wealthy use another time-honored method to avoid taxation, which is to borrow against their accumulated capital and, thus, never get taxed on that capital since it’s never “sold.” Musk is perhaps the best exemplar of that phenomenon. His official pay at Tesla is $1/year, but since all his wealth is in stock, he can readily borrow as much as he needs without ever paying capital-gains taxes. If average Americans could only be taught to see how we’re all being swindled I would like to think that Bernie’s and Warren’s proposals for a modest wealth tax (1% per year for a billionaire? Are you kidding me? As if that would change Musk’s lifestyle?!) makes so much sense. Personally, I’d rather see billionaires go away entirely. How much money do you need to live on? The only thing it does to have such wealth sloshing around at the top is to severely distort our politics and influence-peddling in general—oh, and leave tens of millions of Americans, including millions of children, below the poverty line. As today’s GOP mantra goes, “Cruelty IS the point.”
Judd & Tesmin, thanks again for making me mad whilst I enjoy my morning coffee! Oh, don’t get me wrong, I love you, but you have this tendency to pull the curtain back and reveal the worst among us! Our economy and government lives on a steady diet of greed and corruption. I’m not sure if there’s a way to fix it, short of allowing it to fail. But revealing the facts and exposing the lies and deceit is a monumental step in the right direction, and you do that on a daily/weekly basis! I often recall the words of Lord Axton (1887) “Power tends to corrupt, absolute power corrupts absolutely.” The next line in this quote attributed to Axton is “Great men are almost always bad men…” Can you be a great person without being a bad person? Hmmm.
Amen, except "I’m not sure if there’s a way to fix it, short of allowing it to fail"--that would be worse. The remedy would be to elect viable Democrat majorities in the House and the Senate...and of course the Presidency. Can you imagine the laws that could be changed for the better of the majority of we the people?
Dems have had congressional majorities before and in recent memory. Do they use them to good effect? Unhappily, they ignore some very critical problems like voting accessibility, dark money in politics, tax fairness, climate and environmental health, cyber security, the filibuster, gerymandering, and other issues. Could it be because they are as intertwined with corporate and Wall Street interests as is the GOP?
IMHO, and to be fair, in recent memory, two DINO Senators Joe Manchin, and Kyrsten Lea Sinema diluted the Senate majority. And inspection of publically accessible Congressional voting records still reflects a significant emphasis between the two parties. Based upon voting records, The GOP is, by far, sock-puppets of the Corporatocracy.
Because of the money in politics (thanks to SCOTUS, in no small way) the Billionaires, Corporatists & their hired lobbyists continue to bastardize the way our system is designed. Just like Wall Street hates uncertainty, the billionaire class seems to prefer to maintain the status quo because it is that status quo that they believe is necessary to insulate their wealth from "progress" whose unknown consequences might threaten their kingdoms of money. So, I suspect that they LUV when there are ongoing imbalances between House, Senate & WH and the resulting gridlock.
If voters want real change, vote the Dems a 60 seat Senate majority, and enough seats in the House to override a veto, AND a Democrat President in his second term who is then insulated from the demands of another campaign ... and then ring Bernie Sanders and ask him to come to the WH with his entire wishlist. ;-)
...Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren with hers.
Indeed, I thought about that after I posted. Sorry about the omission.
Whenever a particular industry voices adamant opposition to a government program that’s designed to help lower income people, we can be certain that they are afraid of the competition. Consequently, their arguments against the proposal will be biased and “spun” (if not outright lies). Just look at the opposition to CFPB and FTC (and White House) efforts to reduce closing costs for homebuyers, led by the American Land Title Association and its members. Whatever they (or the tax prep industry) say, believe the opposite.
Love Elizabeth Warren's determination to hold these bad players accountable. Hate that my senator is Mike Crapo. My apologies. Red state Idaho would elect a dead rat as long as there is an R behind the name on the ballot.
Here in Florida, Jimmy Patronis is yammering that the Free IRS is intrusive and would be another way the "gubbermint" can spy on you. This guy is the CFO in Florida and their whole schtick is to blast the Federal Govt because it resonates with the Rednecks. Jimmy is an idiot! They do nothing in Florida to help the lower income or less fortunate. It's all about helping Pulte, Mosaic, Citadel, and all the other Right Wing Rich. SAD!! Jimmy wrongly states that people might forget to file their state income tax. News Flash JUMBO, there is no Florida State Income Tax. Buffoon!!
These are names of those who would see children starve: Joe, Mike and Chuck. Hmmm... I think they are all crap-o.
My 24 yo daughter tried the IRS filing system for three days and could not get anywhere, finally giving up on the morning of April 15th. She then turned to Intuit which I warned her would probably cost money and be as confusing as the IRS filing system. Guess what? It wasn't as complicated and she was deemed a freebie! The government's action against the prevaricating TurboTax musta worked because I don't think they want to give away anything.
As far as the unfair tax system, we know who to blame: Ronnie, Georgie and Donnie come to mind.
Thank you!
Thank you Judd and Tesnim. We remain in your debt!
Reports such as this one always provokes wonder. For example, I wonder what effect revising the government revenue, i.e., tax code, to a flat tax system would have on politics? There would certainly be a ripple effect through industries that have evolved to profit from the progressive tax system and it's ridiculous complexity. At the same time, what would happen to all the money spent to pad election campaign coffers by corporations and individuals looking for big layoffs from tax avoidance?
Oh my. Did you actually say that? A flat tax system would be the ultimate win for the rich, who would then cut every program they couldn't eliminate. Note: low income people pay very low tax rates. That's because they have to eat. Personal and corporate tax rates are already essentially flat, given the low maximum rates in place and the endless ways the rich get around paying taxes at all. And Social Security tax is actually regressive, as the flat rates do not apply to incomes above a very low threshold. You think we have progressive taxation now? Think again.
Yes, I did say that. I was actually using flat tax as a placeholder for anything other than the current system as opposed to being a fanatical supporter of that approach. Happy you got something to latch onto this morning. I believe my overall point still bears out though.
I understand your proposition. My comment points out the insanity of the flat tax and the failure of the insufficiently progressive system we have. Progressive taxation is sane, not fanatical. The fanatics want to institute the flat tax.
Thanks for this. We tax too little and thus spend too little on things like supporting families. American government spends just 0.7% of GDP on family support compare to 3-4 times that of our peer countries.
I wrote a post, below, called "An Open Message To The Top 0.1%" that addresses some aspects of economic inequality.
https://robertsdavidn.substack.com/p/an-open-message-to-the-top-01
Re Grassley and Tillis statements. If only these folks could listen and really hear the drivel that spews from their mouths! What if what the President is doing really IS good and helps many Americans. What if those people helped are their constituents? If their only purpose being a legislator is to further their now totally defunct party...you get the picture. Vote them OUT.
Day after day, week after week, month after month, the litany of greed and self-dealing among the GOP and the rich is disgusting. I am beyond tired of reading about it. For people who'd like a lot of data on how the system is financially rigged, check out the new book by Matthew Desmond, Poverty, By America.