A new middle school sex education curriculum in Orange County, Florida, obtained by Popular Information, eliminates previous lessons on the reproductive system, contraception, and consent.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Also that most sexual abuse of children, including very young children, is committed by relatives. Where are these kids supposed to turn for help?
Is this a surprise, given that this state elected Matt Gaetz, a man allegedly accused of trafficking and having sex with underage girls, as their Congressman? FL is a mess, and looks unattractive not only for relocation, but even vacation. Why would anyone pay to travel to a place whose government values superficial Victorian prudishness over accurate, factual scientific information and unfettered healthcare access? The place is on backwardly aimed rocket sled.
Yes, this area must be addressed by families and other avenues that are shaped to be honest and compassionate. As a psychotherapist I learned through too many adults what many had experienced as children via relatives, caretakers, church functionaries(?). Now it'll be increasingly less safe for children in FL.
What is so interesting to me is that these people think that they are legislating morality. It’s like history has shown them nothing. Who going to stop minors, let’s say kids under 16 from having sex? Is it going to stop young people under 21 from having sex? We all know that that’s not gonna work that way because humans are ever curious, they are ever willful and determined to do what they want to do. Florida has one of the largest HIV rates in United States, and it’s not just among those in the queer community. I just shake my head and wonder at the self-righteous people who call themselves educators, thinking that they are going to control human behavior. The hubris and the arrogance is unbelievable.
They act like this is something new, caused by sex education. I'm living proof that you CAN overcome piss poor sex education by going to the library. In 1965. At 15. But since they're scrubbing the libraries of anything useful, these kids are screwed.
In 1962 I entered a nursing program in IOWA The anatomy professor showed us the pictures published today by Legum and also the male penis. He then told us that the penis entered the vagina during sex. He was very explicit so NURSES would know about human anatomy and reproduction. It was very necessary because of abysmal education in public schools. Not sure I could have found this in our High School Library. Doubtful!
I guess the idea is to have girls be like we were in the 1950s - cluless. So we spent the 1960s trying to find out what it was all about - and abortions were illegal. Wonderful years - not.
IF I had younger children, and IF I could afford the move, I would flee the state of Florida in a skinny minute. Businesses may want to take this information into account when trying to attract employees. Unless you are of a whacked out conservative mind, why would you want to subject your family to this? I have no desire to even visit Florida, don’t want to give them my money.
I grew up there in the 60’s-70’s….nothing was better than Sarasota’s beaches. Now, my beautiful hometown is MAGA central! So very sad. I too will not spend a dime there until things change. The people keep voting in known criminals “Red tide Rick” and non-progressive hatefuls “Desantis”! But, people are “flocking” there! I am Sad and EXHAUSTED!!
I lived in Florida, in Sarasota for almost 40 years. The last time I went back to visit was in 2023 to scatter my husband‘s ashes in the Gulf of Mexico. He was a third generation Floridian. We moved out of Florida in 2014 and retired in North Carolina because Florida was not for us. It did not feel like home at all. And when I was walking around St. Armand’s Circle there in Sarasota, it just felt hostile. There were people walking around with trump shirts on. There were people walking around with shirts on that said f**k Biden. It was horrible. And that couple that started up Moms for liberty? They’re from Sarasota. The woman who started it was in a three-way sex ring with her husband and another woman. I’m telling you every accusation from these Republicans is a confession.
Headlong back into the dark ages we go. We have to remember... kids will be kids...even when placed in leadership roles and supposedly responsible for their state's populations health and well being. This is what happens, after a entire generation of limited education. Leadership is for sale not earned, especially so over the last 40+ years.
"Noe body noes Nuttin...wanna fight about it? "Huh...bring it on you woke, snowflake." Not knowing the real meaning of the term woke ...speaks volumes.
The History of malevolent social and societal behavior can't be known by this generation... if it was never taught to this generation.
So true but no one seems to care about that reality...they have been trained to accept that nothing but "lies" come from the "other side". Which is partially true as many seasoned Democrats have been corrupted by big money corporate entities...it was an easier way to get funding for their next election cycle.
As a sycophant of the incoming president, DeSantis is rebbing up to implement as much of Project 2025's objectives as he can. With the plan to create a Department of Life out of Health and Human Services which is focused on promoting the birthing of any child conceived, and not preventing any conception either, because of the Christian Nationalists writing the document, this is exactly what is wanted.
In fact, the education will be what John Dewey believed in, which is Experience in Education. That is to have a series of experiences leading to understanding of a topic. Usually provided by the teacher. In this case, all of them will learn about sex from experience, and unless they are prevented from having cell phones, or being around others their age who have them, kids are going to get most of their sex education from pornography on the internet. Or from personal experimentation.
I think that someone should take them to court for saying that abstinence is the only 100% safe way to prevent pregnancy or STDs because as far as I know masturbation also fits that description.
So, will be interesting to see how DeSantis handles his own daughter's sexuality. Will he stay in line, or treat her totally differently than the other children he is entrusted to protect and serve?
The lawsuit is an interesting idea; wonder what the courts would do with it? Or maybe a suit on behalf of children who become pregnant through lack of knowledge at some point? Hard to believe this is all happening...
It would be really hard to blame pregnancy on the state because they will say this is false, but one can poke holes in what they are teaching in courts. Also, gets the courts to take a stand on masturbation, which I think would lead to pushback. While pushing back the word would get out because the press would cover it. That would be a way of educating the students. In fact suing for every thing that is factually wrong would be a round about way of informing children. A suit that claims the truth is... on STD and pregnancy information is going to help spread the word to the ignorant masses.
We need to also find ways to educate children. A new comprehensive series on sex ed easily available online might help supplement what schools are not teaching and parents are not teaching.
This reminds me of a story I read years ago where Texas was pushing abstinence only sex ed. Well guess who’s little teenage darling got pregnant - yep, one of the policy pusher’s. The internet is full of articles on the increase in the teen pregnancy rate when abstinence only is taught. According to JD Vance, mom and/or dad should quit their lives to stay home with the grand babies. Have fun!
I gotta wonder how JD squares that with upping the retirement age. So, grandma or pa are supposed to help with the grandbabies, but they can't retire before 75, so they can't help with the grandbabies. Nice Catch-22 he's got going there.
According to his book & public statements he credits his grandmother with raising him. Among other things, when his mother was growing up his grandmother set fire to his grandfather because he was drunk. His mother who was a child put out the fire. Everyone survived. While they were raising him, his grandmother threatened to run over bad kids he was hanging around with & hide the bodies where no one would find them.
He doesn’t seem to connect growing up in a violent households to struggles his mother had during her life or his own opportunistic compassionless self.
My mother was the victim of incest. An older brother started sexual activity with her when she was 5. Sexual activity leads to earlier menarche. My mother was a 4th grader when her periods started and she thought she was dying. A younger brother helped her stand up to the older brother and stop the incest when Mom was 12. She kept that secret until a conversation with me when I was working on my dissertation about highly gifted adults. For some reason, some of the stories from my subjects in my study made Mom tell me about her own experiences. Mom had mental health disorder that almost always has a start with early sexual interference, rape, or incest. It was called borderline personality disorder but has somehow been renamed. She was an emotional train wreck her entire life. And yet, she was brilliant and took me aside when I was a 4th grader and told me everything about sex. In the 1960s I’m not even sure where she got her information, but it was accurate, and kind, and she made it sound like a beautiful wonderful thing created between two people who loved each other. She explained the physical and the emotional. She talked about the different ways males and females think emotionally about sex. She told me about abstinence and birth control. She told me about demanding respect and partnership and waiting until both parties to sex were mature enough to know the pitfalls of being sexual too young. I easily taught my sons about sex and relationships. They lived I. World where the young women knew all about sex but didn’t know all about the advantages of waiting, about not jumping in so early that they were taking chances with not only their hearts but their health. I taught sex Ed in a public school to the sixth graders in the early 70s. I didn’t find it awkward and neither did the students. What’s going on in this country and world around sex is just plain ridiculous. This whole Desantis and right wing Christian approach to education is beyond dangerous. If they’d teach the truth about sex and relationships, they’d see fewer problems, not more.
I'm so sorry about what your Mom endured. She sounds like a resilient and dynamic woman. To survive through what she did and provide you with comprehensive, accurate information, while describing the qualities on healthy relationships is a real testament to her.
I shudder when I see plans to remove accurate sexual education from schools. My parents didn't have "the talk" with me, just said what FL plans to: don't do it until you're married. The lever was the threat of them enforcing a shotgun union themselves in response to any pregnancy. That didn't give me information, though, and without junior high sex ed, everything I knew would have been from overhearing the "big kids" talking about it on the bus. Looks like many FL are about to get the same.
I'm shocked--shouldn't it at least include information about how threesomes and rape are not disqualifying for leaders of the Republican Party or the Mom's for Liberty founders? Or by not mentioning it does it not exist?
This aligns neatly with the dismissal of the maternal mortality review committee in the state of Georgia because it is apparently inappropriate for a maternal mortality review committee to publish information about maternal mortality. Pretty soon, public health agencies will be restricted to publishing nothing but reams of blank paper. At which point, of course, the funding can be removed because obviously there’s no purpose to having public health agencies. They’re just so inefficient, you see. And they don’t do anything.
This is precisely what will happen - there will be no data provided by the government to argue for or against. The Florida BoE will simply say, "Nobody can blame us, because we teach kids abstinence, and that is actually 100% effective against unwanted pregnancy and STDs on an individual basis." Which is true, except that it is not really possible to teach abstinence. It would be like trying to teach someone not to talk.
How can they abstain without a full understanding of the activity from which they are abstaining? Ignorant people are more easily manipulated with lies. This is sex education optimized for sexual predator success.
I do hate living here in Florida now. This is why I left in 1969! What was I thinking when I came back 8 yrs ago? It wasn’t quite as wacky then as it’s gotten, but now! Now it’s really torture to have to endure all of this insanity. And sex Ed is just the tip of the craziness iceberg.
Not if the P2025 people get their way and make it illegal like they threaten to. They'll have to go old school and use the ladies underwear photos in ads from department stores.
Next in Florida, Oklahoma etc. will be amending the Trump Bible as required school sex education reading and oath-taking, the importance of girls and women wearing the fool-proof and time-tested chastity belts where the pater familias would have the key. What could possibly go wrong?
This will also leave children vulnerable to sex abuse with no vocabulary to even describe it.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Also that most sexual abuse of children, including very young children, is committed by relatives. Where are these kids supposed to turn for help?
Is this a surprise, given that this state elected Matt Gaetz, a man allegedly accused of trafficking and having sex with underage girls, as their Congressman? FL is a mess, and looks unattractive not only for relocation, but even vacation. Why would anyone pay to travel to a place whose government values superficial Victorian prudishness over accurate, factual scientific information and unfettered healthcare access? The place is on backwardly aimed rocket sled.
Exactly why I refuse to go there!
Another of the few tools we have left as opposition is to withhold providing any financial benefit to these 19th century wannabe states. Spend blue!
Excellent point.
My thought was, leaving out consent, no good touch bad touch? Wow!
Yes, this area must be addressed by families and other avenues that are shaped to be honest and compassionate. As a psychotherapist I learned through too many adults what many had experienced as children via relatives, caretakers, church functionaries(?). Now it'll be increasingly less safe for children in FL.
What is so interesting to me is that these people think that they are legislating morality. It’s like history has shown them nothing. Who going to stop minors, let’s say kids under 16 from having sex? Is it going to stop young people under 21 from having sex? We all know that that’s not gonna work that way because humans are ever curious, they are ever willful and determined to do what they want to do. Florida has one of the largest HIV rates in United States, and it’s not just among those in the queer community. I just shake my head and wonder at the self-righteous people who call themselves educators, thinking that they are going to control human behavior. The hubris and the arrogance is unbelievable.
Right- like outlawing abortion will stop it.
They act like this is something new, caused by sex education. I'm living proof that you CAN overcome piss poor sex education by going to the library. In 1965. At 15. But since they're scrubbing the libraries of anything useful, these kids are screwed.
In 1962 I entered a nursing program in IOWA The anatomy professor showed us the pictures published today by Legum and also the male penis. He then told us that the penis entered the vagina during sex. He was very explicit so NURSES would know about human anatomy and reproduction. It was very necessary because of abysmal education in public schools. Not sure I could have found this in our High School Library. Doubtful!
I went to the public library, didn't even try the one at school.
I guess the idea is to have girls be like we were in the 1950s - cluless. So we spent the 1960s trying to find out what it was all about - and abortions were illegal. Wonderful years - not.
IF I had younger children, and IF I could afford the move, I would flee the state of Florida in a skinny minute. Businesses may want to take this information into account when trying to attract employees. Unless you are of a whacked out conservative mind, why would you want to subject your family to this? I have no desire to even visit Florida, don’t want to give them my money.
I grew up there in the 60’s-70’s….nothing was better than Sarasota’s beaches. Now, my beautiful hometown is MAGA central! So very sad. I too will not spend a dime there until things change. The people keep voting in known criminals “Red tide Rick” and non-progressive hatefuls “Desantis”! But, people are “flocking” there! I am Sad and EXHAUSTED!!
I lived in Florida, in Sarasota for almost 40 years. The last time I went back to visit was in 2023 to scatter my husband‘s ashes in the Gulf of Mexico. He was a third generation Floridian. We moved out of Florida in 2014 and retired in North Carolina because Florida was not for us. It did not feel like home at all. And when I was walking around St. Armand’s Circle there in Sarasota, it just felt hostile. There were people walking around with trump shirts on. There were people walking around with shirts on that said f**k Biden. It was horrible. And that couple that started up Moms for liberty? They’re from Sarasota. The woman who started it was in a three-way sex ring with her husband and another woman. I’m telling you every accusation from these Republicans is a confession.
So true! Like your late husband, I have requested my ashes be scattered there too… might have to rethink. Sorry for your loss.
Headlong back into the dark ages we go. We have to remember... kids will be kids...even when placed in leadership roles and supposedly responsible for their state's populations health and well being. This is what happens, after a entire generation of limited education. Leadership is for sale not earned, especially so over the last 40+ years.
"Noe body noes Nuttin...wanna fight about it? "Huh...bring it on you woke, snowflake." Not knowing the real meaning of the term woke ...speaks volumes.
The History of malevolent social and societal behavior can't be known by this generation... if it was never taught to this generation.
Handmaid's Tale coming to life. These "righteous" leaders have some of the most hideous skeletons in their closets.
So true but no one seems to care about that reality...they have been trained to accept that nothing but "lies" come from the "other side". Which is partially true as many seasoned Democrats have been corrupted by big money corporate entities...it was an easier way to get funding for their next election cycle.
As a sycophant of the incoming president, DeSantis is rebbing up to implement as much of Project 2025's objectives as he can. With the plan to create a Department of Life out of Health and Human Services which is focused on promoting the birthing of any child conceived, and not preventing any conception either, because of the Christian Nationalists writing the document, this is exactly what is wanted.
In fact, the education will be what John Dewey believed in, which is Experience in Education. That is to have a series of experiences leading to understanding of a topic. Usually provided by the teacher. In this case, all of them will learn about sex from experience, and unless they are prevented from having cell phones, or being around others their age who have them, kids are going to get most of their sex education from pornography on the internet. Or from personal experimentation.
I think that someone should take them to court for saying that abstinence is the only 100% safe way to prevent pregnancy or STDs because as far as I know masturbation also fits that description.
So, will be interesting to see how DeSantis handles his own daughter's sexuality. Will he stay in line, or treat her totally differently than the other children he is entrusted to protect and serve?
Law for thee, but not for me. CONservative guidepost.
The lawsuit is an interesting idea; wonder what the courts would do with it? Or maybe a suit on behalf of children who become pregnant through lack of knowledge at some point? Hard to believe this is all happening...
It would be really hard to blame pregnancy on the state because they will say this is false, but one can poke holes in what they are teaching in courts. Also, gets the courts to take a stand on masturbation, which I think would lead to pushback. While pushing back the word would get out because the press would cover it. That would be a way of educating the students. In fact suing for every thing that is factually wrong would be a round about way of informing children. A suit that claims the truth is... on STD and pregnancy information is going to help spread the word to the ignorant masses.
'poke holes'. you are so funny.
The conservative hope is that parents will take the place of schools in teaching sex education.
The better, but by no means optimal, solution is for schools to provide comprehensive sex and anatomy education allowing for parental opt outs.
We need to end the "I don't like it therefore YOU can't have it" dogma that pervades too many of us and leads to legislation like this.
We need to also find ways to educate children. A new comprehensive series on sex ed easily available online might help supplement what schools are not teaching and parents are not teaching.
Woke=Aware, Knowing, Enlightened.
Not Woke= Unaware, Unknowing, Ignorant.
Any questions?
So true. They don't even know to look it up.
This reminds me of a story I read years ago where Texas was pushing abstinence only sex ed. Well guess who’s little teenage darling got pregnant - yep, one of the policy pusher’s. The internet is full of articles on the increase in the teen pregnancy rate when abstinence only is taught. According to JD Vance, mom and/or dad should quit their lives to stay home with the grand babies. Have fun!
I gotta wonder how JD squares that with upping the retirement age. So, grandma or pa are supposed to help with the grandbabies, but they can't retire before 75, so they can't help with the grandbabies. Nice Catch-22 he's got going there.
According to his book & public statements he credits his grandmother with raising him. Among other things, when his mother was growing up his grandmother set fire to his grandfather because he was drunk. His mother who was a child put out the fire. Everyone survived. While they were raising him, his grandmother threatened to run over bad kids he was hanging around with & hide the bodies where no one would find them.
He doesn’t seem to connect growing up in a violent households to struggles his mother had during her life or his own opportunistic compassionless self.
Remember Sarah Palin's darling daughter? She was a teen mom.
My mother was the victim of incest. An older brother started sexual activity with her when she was 5. Sexual activity leads to earlier menarche. My mother was a 4th grader when her periods started and she thought she was dying. A younger brother helped her stand up to the older brother and stop the incest when Mom was 12. She kept that secret until a conversation with me when I was working on my dissertation about highly gifted adults. For some reason, some of the stories from my subjects in my study made Mom tell me about her own experiences. Mom had mental health disorder that almost always has a start with early sexual interference, rape, or incest. It was called borderline personality disorder but has somehow been renamed. She was an emotional train wreck her entire life. And yet, she was brilliant and took me aside when I was a 4th grader and told me everything about sex. In the 1960s I’m not even sure where she got her information, but it was accurate, and kind, and she made it sound like a beautiful wonderful thing created between two people who loved each other. She explained the physical and the emotional. She talked about the different ways males and females think emotionally about sex. She told me about abstinence and birth control. She told me about demanding respect and partnership and waiting until both parties to sex were mature enough to know the pitfalls of being sexual too young. I easily taught my sons about sex and relationships. They lived I. World where the young women knew all about sex but didn’t know all about the advantages of waiting, about not jumping in so early that they were taking chances with not only their hearts but their health. I taught sex Ed in a public school to the sixth graders in the early 70s. I didn’t find it awkward and neither did the students. What’s going on in this country and world around sex is just plain ridiculous. This whole Desantis and right wing Christian approach to education is beyond dangerous. If they’d teach the truth about sex and relationships, they’d see fewer problems, not more.
I'm so sorry about what your Mom endured. She sounds like a resilient and dynamic woman. To survive through what she did and provide you with comprehensive, accurate information, while describing the qualities on healthy relationships is a real testament to her.
I shudder when I see plans to remove accurate sexual education from schools. My parents didn't have "the talk" with me, just said what FL plans to: don't do it until you're married. The lever was the threat of them enforcing a shotgun union themselves in response to any pregnancy. That didn't give me information, though, and without junior high sex ed, everything I knew would have been from overhearing the "big kids" talking about it on the bus. Looks like many FL are about to get the same.
I'm shocked--shouldn't it at least include information about how threesomes and rape are not disqualifying for leaders of the Republican Party or the Mom's for Liberty founders? Or by not mentioning it does it not exist?
This aligns neatly with the dismissal of the maternal mortality review committee in the state of Georgia because it is apparently inappropriate for a maternal mortality review committee to publish information about maternal mortality. Pretty soon, public health agencies will be restricted to publishing nothing but reams of blank paper. At which point, of course, the funding can be removed because obviously there’s no purpose to having public health agencies. They’re just so inefficient, you see. And they don’t do anything.
GREAT JOB, EVERYONE!
This is precisely what will happen - there will be no data provided by the government to argue for or against. The Florida BoE will simply say, "Nobody can blame us, because we teach kids abstinence, and that is actually 100% effective against unwanted pregnancy and STDs on an individual basis." Which is true, except that it is not really possible to teach abstinence. It would be like trying to teach someone not to talk.
Sex Ed minus the sex? OK. HIV is up in Florida? Just wait. I hear abortions are up since Roe vs Wade came down and there's more to come.
How can they abstain without a full understanding of the activity from which they are abstaining? Ignorant people are more easily manipulated with lies. This is sex education optimized for sexual predator success.
*sigh*. Not at all suprising coming from an autocracy. If they want to stop reliving history, FL need to wake up and THEN to vote.
I do hate living here in Florida now. This is why I left in 1969! What was I thinking when I came back 8 yrs ago? It wasn’t quite as wacky then as it’s gotten, but now! Now it’s really torture to have to endure all of this insanity. And sex Ed is just the tip of the craziness iceberg.
They will have to get their sex education from porn hub instead.
Studied ass-iduously by legislators.
Especially "R's!" Wonder why they are so dang repressed.
Not if the P2025 people get their way and make it illegal like they threaten to. They'll have to go old school and use the ladies underwear photos in ads from department stores.
Next in Florida, Oklahoma etc. will be amending the Trump Bible as required school sex education reading and oath-taking, the importance of girls and women wearing the fool-proof and time-tested chastity belts where the pater familias would have the key. What could possibly go wrong?